I just bought a couple old jointers but I also am going to be using them semi commercially. Depends on your price point. After I upgrade to helical heads and take them apart and refurbish them, I might come close or over the price point of a new one. That is, if they were a 12".

Mine are 16" and 20". These I still might come in cheaper than new.

Jointers are pretty simple machines though. If you don't mind not having a warranty, then buying a used one would be easy to fix and maintain on your own but the prices of a 12" Oliver and Porter, after shipping are almost the same as a new Grizzly with the helical head.

I had been searching over a year so I have seen the prices all over the country for a while. Is this hobby, semi pro, or commercial use?

 

It's mainly for hobby use currently but I'm in the process of transitioning.

I can guess the differences between hobby and professional but what would the difference be between professional and industrial beyond robustness of the machine. What environment would call for such differences if any?

 

I recently bought one of these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/262824755452?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

But I have yet to actually turn it on. It's currently sitting in my driveway, tarped, with all the metal parts sprayed down with a corrosion inhibitor. I'm waiting on a 3 phase converter.

But for the price it seemed like I would be really hard pressed to find something better. It ticked all the boxes for me: spiral cutterhead, long tables, takes up less space than separate planer and jointer, and the 16" capacity is nothing to scoff at.

 

One different between old industrial iron is the build quality.My Oliver 166 has a 5 inch cutting circle the overall table length is 99 inches.They are very flat less than .002 so I can take a very lite cut on small thin parts or large.Its direct drive 3 ph and it's very smooth and quite.
It did take me time and money to get it where it is now a finishing machine.That will outshine anything from China with a Bryd Head.

 

Old iron hands down. The Grizzly is no doubt a nice machine but not in the same class as an Oliver. It certainly takes much longer to wait for just the right machine and can be a bit of a logistical headache but it'll be so worth it!

 

Mlipps,

I suppose it comes down to whether you want to spend the time and money bringing an older machine back to its former glory or begin using the machine immediately. It also could be frustrating trying to find parts for an older machine. But then if patience pays off, you could end up with an older machine that requires little or no rehab work for less money.

As for the warranty on a new machine; it is comforting to have one and perhaps suggests the confidence the manufacturer has in their machine. Luckily I have never made a warranty claim since I suspect it would be a very unpleasant experience, even if all went smoothly.

 

Look for northfield jointers as well. Even the old ones apparently stay true after several decades w/o any adjustment.

My $0.02 is to get the combination jointer/planer machine with a good helical head. It saves space although DC is a little tricky. You get to share the cost of the helical head on 2 machines. Switchover time is less of a concern for hobbyist. These machines are much more mobile than those old aircraft carriers.

I rebuilt a Delta DJ-20 8" jointer with a Byrd head and it was a lot of work which probably would have been better spent woodworking. The fence should probably be reground/milled flat, but I don't want to spend any more money on it. If I had to do it over, I would hold out for a good combo machine on CL or some auction that doesn't need much work.

 

Have a look at Paul Lemiski's RAS, Jointer and thicknesser they are old.

This may possibly be of some assistance in making a decision

 

I've got the 12" Griz with HSS (parallolgram) had it for 10 years and its a good jointer. Only issue I have is design on DC requires an ocasional cleanout underneath but not a big deal.

Now, you say old American Iron, there is no coparrison. Those are beasts. Only down side is DC as generally lacking. Second moving them requires some effort.

My Griz is heavy but nothing compared to the old stuff. However you don't move them after set so I don't know how much it matters.

You could get a big old one for less I'm sure. Look for a 3phase one, and put a converter on it. Best way to go.

 

I love CanadianWoodworks.

It's such a shame that the build quality of days past isn't maintained in modern manufacturing.

Also, thanks all for confirming what I suspected. Sometimes it's good to hear it from someone else.

I was wondering does anyone know of a good place to pick up one of these behemoths? I have no idea where to begin. Also if mobility is a requirement should I even bother? I can't imagine there being a mobile base able to equip one of these machines.

I guess what it boils down to is which is my better bang for the buck. Am I doing myself a disservice by spending 3k on a new jointer vs an older one?

 

I love CanadianWoodworks.

It s such a shame that the build quality of days past isn t maintained in modern manufacturing.

Also, thanks all for confirming what I suspected. Sometimes it s good to hear it from someone else.

I was wondering does anyone know of a good place to pick up one of these behemoths? I have no idea where to begin. Also if mobility is a requirement should I even bother? I can t imagine there being a mobile base able to equip one of these machines.

I guess what it boils down to is which is my better bang for the buck. Am I doing myself a disservice by spending 3k on a new jointer vs an older one?

- mlipps

I don't have a machine shop, nor do I have a ton of time so I opted for buying a newer tool that just needs to be plugged in and maybe tuned a little. Unless you get an affordable ready-to-go "old iron" machine (unlikely), you'll need to expect a lot of work. Replacing bearings, possibly dealing with stripped screws/bolts, worn out ways or other adjustments, missing parts, etc.

Also, you can make a mobile base for anything, if you have thick enough steel and big enough casters.

I purchased 3" x 3" x 3/8" angle iron for the mobile base for my JP-1686 (950lbs tool weight), and 5" cast iron casters rated @ 650lbs per caster. Essentially, casters need to be rated so that two casters can handle the full load of the tool and then a margin of error. Unless your floor is perfectly flat, while moving the load is often momentarily supported by only two of the four wheels. My casters were purchased on ebay, was about $50 for the set of four (including shipping). The steel was from a the surplus yard of a local steel distributor and cost me $0.40/lb, or about $55 for the three six-foot lengths I bought.

Take a look at a pallet jack. Most pallet jacks are rated for carrying 5000lbs and they have two little fixed wheels in the forks and a pair of big (like 7-8") wheels attached to the steering handle. The bigger wheels are easier to roll with really heavy loads, but they cost more.

 

As far as sourcing old iron, I scout Craigslist often and the newspapers online classified sections. Look for auctions too as things can sometimes go for cheap if it's not well advertised or something only a few people might be interested in. I have a 12" Crescent that I found on CL about an hour from me and asked many questions along with a little contingent price negotiation. I had to rent a trailer as I didn't have one at the time and when I got to see it in person everything was as promised and both parties fulfilled our respective ends of the verbal agreement. He loaded it on the trailer with a backhoe, I strapped it down as was off. It was heavier than expected as around 1500lbs. with the motor installed so it was a good thing I ate my Wheaties that morning as I had to push it down a couple ramps off the trailer and into position in my shop. I'm glad I did it and would do the same again if I wasn't in a time crunch. Good luck iron hunting.

 

I check CL often. I'm in New York. Any recommendations on what auctions sites to use?

 

If you are seriously into wood working and appreciate the quality of old iron, then that is the way to go. That goes for any machine. If it is not for serious work, but just a hobby, then new is the way to go. Buying and using old iron is more than just working with a fine machine. It is an investment and pride of ownership.

 

MAchinerymax.com is good for woodworking
stuff. Ebay is always worth keeping an eye on
and owwm.org has a classifieds for old machines
that gets a lot of activity… lots of old 12" and
larger jointers get sold through that site.

 

As for local auctions, I there are a few auction houses around me that do everything from small estate auctions to industrial plant liquidations. Unfortunately I've found none that allow potential buyers to set up any kind of alert which for me would be very helpful, instead I just have to be diligent and keep checking often to see if anything is coming up to the block hat I might be interested in.

 

yep they dont make em like that any more …ask Paul where he got his from.

I would hate to think what the cost of a new ones of a similar size would be.
The there is the delivery and setup costs.

 

I did a quick search and since you mention spending $3K I was about to find a couple within three hours from me. https://cleveland.craigslist.org/bfs/6037319981.html, this one's not super old like old iron can be considered but could represent a good value for someone looking for a combo machine. https://youngstown.craigslist.org/tls/6021006114.html, this one is older and certainly represents what many think of when referencing good quality old iron. Logistically both of these would be considerable work for someone nearby, never mind coming from NY. I've heard many times of people making significant road trips just to pickup some old iron but these seem like market value deals, not so much the amazing steals that make folks want to travel. That's just my 2 cents.

 

It s such a shame that the build quality of days past isn t maintained in modern manufacturing.

- mlipps

The build quality still exists but at an appropriate price. Jeff at Northfield will be happy to build you a 12" jointer for $14k-18K. People just aren't willing or are unable to pay for that level of quality, this is why Asian imports dominate the market. Felder, SCMi and others also build top notch jointers, for a price.

Woodweb, eBay and OWWM are all good places to search. Note that Oliver, Northfield (due to parts and support availability) and Porter often go for a premium but many of the similar old iron that aren't considered "grail" machines can often be bargains. One needs to do a little research before pulling the trigger. I am a fan of 3 toed jointers and would take my Northfield or a Porter over an Oliver.