Titebond 3 says 30 minutes minimum to remove from clamps. Set for 24 hours with no stress for maximum bond. I haven't bothered rereading the label on the other TB's, because I'm going from years of using their product.

Above is not criticism. It's good that you are seeking ways and different products to use. You have to remember that the hide glue was invented back at the start of the caveman days. It's been around a long time, and is still used for some applications. It's also easy to make if you're inclined…... ..... Jerry (in Tucson)

 

Dan,
I think this is interesting for a short time glue setup test. I think you should try the same test but let the glue set up for 24 hours and see in what order the glues fail respectively. You will need a lot more than 8.5 lbs for that test though…

 

Daniel,
I love these kinds of side-by-sides, even without a perfectly repeatable control group. One question: how long did you let each adhesive cure for, and how long does each one recommend for curing before use?

 

Some of us aren't surprised. You would have had the same result with the hot hide glue if you had held it for only 30 seconds. ...... just one of its many advantages.

 

Thanks for the interest Jerry and Jerry and Dustin. The adhesives cured for 24 hours right on the button. And yes it wasn't a fair test for the TiteBond 3, but I had an extra piece so I ran it for the heck of it. Had it been clamped "properly" I expect it would have held under the heavier force.

The reason for the "human fingers" clamping is because that is the only viable way to access the joints on the small boxes I make. Like this one I just finished.

 

Looks like you were right on on the Hide Glue Paul. I will be trying it on some different applications now.

 

On the failed joints, what actually failed, the glue or the wood?

As I understand it, with Titebond, if glued properly (clamped), the wood fails rather than the glue.

I do understand that the joints were not clamped. And that you were trying to figure out what works best in your application. And I agree that is exactly what matters. Makes no difference if glue A is better than glue B when clamped, if you cannot clamp.

Lot's of times glues are chosen based on practical aspects of the application. Sometimes you can clamp and wait, sometime you need it glued right now.

Thanks for the data point.

 

There are numerous glue tests floating around, and most (if not all) show titebond as being the strongest, although not by much compared to some others.

Here is one by Mattias, but excludes hide glue. Titebond III wins.
Glue strength testing (woodgears.ca)

Fine Woodworking magazine also did a comparison, and included both types of hide glue as well as polyurethane. The results were the same, with titebond coming out on top (and hide glue down towards the bottom of the list). The article can be found here: How Strong Is Your Glue?

The glues tested were:

And the results were:

Cheers,
Brad

 

I don't think the test is on point with wood working.There is zero long grain for the glues to do what they are designed to do.Its cross grain so that's a little bit better than eng grain.
I do like to see others doing glue tests.
Some day try making a door with a floating panel.Make the panel out of flat sawn stock.Finish both sides and leave it out side for a year see where it fails.

 

Clin, this is the epoxy joint fail. As you can see it is some wood and some adhesive fail.

This is the TiteBond 3 fail. Also some small wood pieces torn out with the glue. I'm thinking that scoring the mating surfaces may also have been a disadvantage for the TiteBond.

Brad, yes I have seen those test results and I wonder if there were any gaps for the T-88 to even fill, or if they may have overclamped it, if they peerformed the tests equally. They don't mention this.

 

I don t think the test is on point with wood working.There is zero long grain for the glues to do what they are designed to do.Its cross grain so that s a little bit better than eng grain.
I do like to see others doing glue tests.
Some day try making a door with a floating panel.Make the panel out of flat sawn stock.Finish both sides and leave it out side for a year see where it fails.

- Aj2

Aj2, I think my test is a very pointed test, perhaps for a somewhat singular spot located on the outer fringes of the vast spectrum of woodworking, though.

 

I see, how about the same size glue area with the same wood only long grain to long grain.
Then we'll see who's point is more pointy.

 

I tried boiling spaghetti, ravioli, and an egg and all three failed to boil when I tested them after 14 seconds in the water.

 

I tried boiling spaghetti, ravioli, and an egg and all three failed to boil when I tested them after 14 seconds in the water.

- gargey

You need more altitude dude!!

 

Good to know for quick applications. I'm usually a titebond guy but there may be a time for something else.

 

I see, how about the same size glue area with the same wood only long grain to long grain.
Then we ll see who s point is more pointy.

- Aj2

Aj2, Okay, I will make a box with grain going vertical and put big hinges on it.

 

Wow, can we please have a few more snarky & judgmental comments from people who aren't even attempting to understand the point? If you are going to criticize someone, please put at least 60 seconds into reading the thread and trying to comprehend what's going on. I understand where the first few comments came from. I don't understand the negativity once it was explained that the glue had 24 hours to cure and why the test was being done that way.

Daniel, thank you for sharing your results. While it may be unscientific, I totally agree with clin that it is what works best in your application that matters. Kudos to you for actually taking the time to test part of your woodworking in order to make it better instead of just blindly following conventional wisdom.

 

Daniel, Thank you for testing and sharing. Sorry, but I'm a very skeptical guy. To get more equal glue results, I'd be interested to see the same test with two flat surfaces. I just don't trust your joint to be equal across all three samples. Thanks for sharing though.

 

Wow, can we please have a few more snarky & judgmental comments from people who aren t even attempting to understand the point?

I can't think of any more but will get back to you.

 

Thanks for the comment Dave. Jay, yes I agree it seems that some didn't read through the explanations, but comments are always appreciated.

rance, Of course the three samples are not precisely equal, but they are certainly equal through the lense of common sense. And, at the very least I know that the hide glue does work very well in this particular application. And what's more it is reversible, which is also important here.

I did some practice with the Hot hide glue and in fact did the flat surface to flat surface joint you are talking about, and I have to say it is solid.

 

If any one wants to pick on hot hide glue, could you please not pick on strength. It's way stronger than wood. Further strength is just a pi*ing contest really.
We all make our own choices and have our own prejudices. Here is someone who devised a test to see how some materials performed in a particular context where he needed to use them. Some proved better than others. I call that a good test and a positive result.

Lighten up will ya?

 

Wow, can we please have a few more snarky & judgmental comments from people who aren t even attempting to understand the point?

I can t think of any more but will get back to you.

- gargey

DKV or just another troll. Pretty much the same thing.

 

I think clamping pressure is a key factor for yellow wood glue. I wouldn't expect it to hold without adequate clamping and cure time.

 

Hard to say pinto. Some of tests Matthias did showed that lighter clamping worked just as good.

 

I m thinking that scoring the mating surfaces may also have been a disadvantage for the TiteBond.

- DanielP

I'm not sure that scoring is helpful for any of this. I get the idea, but I think that is only useful when gluing non-porous surfaces. Each scoring line becomes a stress riser.

While not the same thing, it's a bit like once you get a crack started, it is easier for it to spread. It's one reason that sanding the surface of a structural piece will increase the amount of force it will take before it fails. This at least is very true of small structures. I.E., probably makes no practical difference on a 2×4, but does on a 1/4" x 1/4' stick.

I give you lots of credit for just getting in there and testing (and putting up with some grief here).