LumberJocks Woodworking Forum banner
21 - 33 of 33 Posts
sure is a whole lotta over thinking here, insulation is not rocket science, nor is figuring out the wall stuff.

talk to an insulator , probably cost nothing to get some estimates and along with that some advise, whole lotta conjecture and mis direction going on. jmo.
 
sure is a whole lotta over thinking here, insulation is not rocket science, nor is figuring out the wall stuff.

talk to an insulator , probably cost nothing to get some estimates and along with that some advise, whole lotta conjecture and mis direction going on. jmo.

- Knockonit
Care to elaborate on that. A contractor is easy if you can afford it, the OP obviously wants to learn how to do it himself. He wants to do a safe installation, as inexpensively as possible with the kind of resources he can work with. If the op just wanted a contractor to come in and handle it, he would not have had to ask the question "How do I do it within my means".
 
nothing wrong with getting an estimate and discuss install with a professional, usually no string attached, there is a whole lot of information here that is not in his best interests to try. Most companies will provide information and go thru the process and options, but hey, what do i know, only been building for lifetime. And yeah i get the wanna do it yourself, but sometimes it takes a professional to steer you right the first time. options, fella, lots more options than we can ever think of
hope op gets some professional advice before somethign goes amiss.
R j
 
Having a contractor give you an estimate is not rocket science I think the OP has considered that but has decided it either is not in his budget or is interested in learning to do it himself. I agree some of the advice is questionable at best, but if you are really concerned for the OP why don't you call it out rather than making insinuations that encompass everyones advice, which is not all questionable. It makes it look like no one can do it right except a contractor and that is just self serving.

I can give you an example where I called out similar ludicrous advice by the same poster, you have probably read it. The reward is it makes you look like the bad guy, so why continue, hopefully the OP recognizes it for what it is.
 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
Thanks for the good advice both Carlos and knockonit. Carlos is right that I'm committed to learning to do it myself, which is why I asked here. On the other hand, there is always some screwball advice out there. Hopefully I have enough common sense to separate the wheat from the chaff.

I think bringing in another set of eyes is a good idea. If I'm going to learn, I want to do it right. I generally learn best by ignoring good advice and making bad mistakes, but when the price tag is big enough, I'm a little more cautious.

Our realtor put me in touch with a general renovations guy who is a licensed contractor. I'm going to have him do some electrical work, and it sounds like he's happy to take a look at the roof and point me in the right direction.

In any case, the more I have thought about it, the more it seems like putting the ceiling below the existing joists is the way to go. When I add the missing joists back in, it will be difficult to store large items up there anyways, and this will make lots of things easier: ventilation, drywall/osb sheathing, later access to fix the inevitable mistakes, etc.
 
I think bringing in another set of eyes is a good idea. If I m going to learn, I want to do it right. I generally learn best by ignoring good advice and making bad mistakes, but when the price tag is big enough, I m a little more cautious.

In any case, the more I have thought about it, the more it seems like putting the ceiling below the existing joists is the way to go. When I add the missing joists back in, it will be difficult to store large items up there anyways, and this will make lots of things easier: ventilation, drywall/osb sheathing, later access to fix the inevitable mistakes, etc.

- nickajeglin
Sound like you are on the right track.
I too try to do all I can myself. Both for money saving and the satisfaction that I did it.
But plenty of jobs have been above my knowledge or skill level. Before I have given in and hired a pro, I have consulted with the pros to help me figure it out, make sure I do it right.
With this sort of advise I have managed to add two 110v, and a 220v circuit to my shop. (I did hire that pro to install the breaker in the panel), and the rest was on me.

I added a mini split A/C to the shop last year. Tried to go pro all the way with it. I really did not feel I wanted to deal with trying to install my own A/C.
But a couple bids later, both wanted 6K+ to do it. Way outside of my budget.
That got me looking at DIY mini splits, and I did it myself. For 2K. I did have that same electrician come back for the 220v circuit breaker. I Just don't like getting into the panel myself.
But I tell this story, because the free estimates from the pro HVAC guys, gave me the information I needed to go out on my own. (location in the shop for the unit, proper size of A/C unit, and electrical needs.)
I also have plenty of projects that I have done twice because I screwed it up the first time around. lol.
We all learn the hard way I think.

So a friend did a similar job that you are about to do some years ago. He wanted to save the 12' ceiling height, but in the end to properly insulate he only had 9'. He has that sloped roof, so he picked a spot in the high side of the shop where he built a pocket into the ceiling. He had to work with the width of the roof trusses. I think they were 18" or 20" on center. And he made it about 5' long. Gave himself a pocket to store a few longer boards, and sheet goods. Seems to work for him.
Good luck
 
Discussion starter · #29 ·
Thanks for all the advice everyone! After talking to the refurb guy, I decided to build the ceiling out under the joists and just insulate that. I got the missing joists reinstalled today. We're back at 24" centers, with due consideration of local snow load (I even bumped it up one level) and heel joints fastened as God and the IBC intended. Next up, I'm sealing leaks and laying in R30 faced batts between the joists. We'll see how it feels after that to decide if I also insulate the walls.

P.S. Framing nailers turn out to be awesome.
 
Discussion starter · #31 ·
Don t forget to run electric up there for lights BEFORE you insulate/sheetrock.

- swandog
Good advice, but too late! :D

R30 batts and Sheetrock is laid in and taped. Electrician is coming on Monday, and running conduit over the sheetrock. It's already way more comfortable in there, but I'm also having him put in an outside box for a mini-split ac/heat pump. Right now I'm tearing out shelving in preparation to seal the inside of the block. As I walk around, I can see light through several areas where the mortar pulled away from the blocks due to the roof missing joists.
 
Read your code. Talk to inspectors.
For a shop, you want to rock over the insulation. Don't forget the full uninterrupted vapor barrier. There is a lot of information on the WEB for how to insulate. Don't expect woodworkers to know your local code or be professional insulation installers. Spray foam is great , if you can afford it. SOP is 1 to 2 inches of foam, then something cheap over it. Attics typically blown FG. Walls typically bats.

Do run overkill power while it is open.
 
In my detached garage I put r19 fiberglass insulation in the walls and r30 in the ceiling. I installed a 50,000 btu bigmaxx furnace and use a 10,000 btu window air conditioner. Furnace was $400 and $0 and a case of beer to run the gas line. Window air unit free neighbor moved and didn't need it anymore. I am warm in the winter (70degrees) and cool in the summer. As far as code goes as long as I do it myself and do it right I am not worried about a subpar job that some contractors will give you. I only got an inspection when the garage was built . Just the basic wiring and plumbing was inspected. I installed my own 200amp panel and the inspector gave it flying Colors. Everything I have done after the final inspection was on my own. I figure if there's an issue when the house is sold my ashes aren't going to worry.
 
21 - 33 of 33 Posts