I used dry pumice once when I was in jr high and never heard of rottenstone till recently. You are right a lot of good information. I do have one question. I used food grade diatomaceous earth. Is food grade necessary. I could buy it at home depot but it not food grade because its sold as an insecticide. Its not a poison but it does kill bugs by drying them out

 

All the stuff I'm using it straight out of the mine. It's not marketed as food grade, but it is the raw stuff that is put on grain to keep weevils down during storage, in animal food for parasites, . . .

Diatomaceous is also heated to a few thousand degrees, which crystallizes it for use in purification filters (wine, etc.). HOWEVER, because of the crystals it forms, when heated to high temps, it becomes lethal.

The main thing is, you need it in a fine powder (like any powder, avoid breathing it, for health reasons).

I was told diatomaceous earth kills many bugs because, when they crawl over it, it scrapes the protective coating off their bodies, leading to dehydration.

 

thanks kelly. I wonder what the difference is between food grade, just the package. Can you used beewax out of the hive or does it need to be purified thnks Mike

 

I don't have a spray booth, though I do have a Spraytech airless, a four stage HVLP Capsprayer and an Accuspray conversion sprayer.

The last spray worth job I did was at a friend's. Instead of spaying, I laid on seven coats of oil based poly. I sanded at about 400 using paper and buff pads between coats. I used water to wash away the dust, and to act as a lube.

On the final, I used an electric pad sander, 600 and a mineral oil. I wiped all that off and went to oil and pumice, then rottenstone, then McGuire's plastic polish. I still have McGuire's around, but do most my work with the mixes talked about above.

In the end, the final finish looks, exactly, like a good spray finish (no brush marks, high shine).

 

As long as debris is removed from the wax, it would work fine.

Over the years, like others, I suspect, I developed a subconscious assumption most commercially sold products were complicated and special, even in spite of obvious information to the contrary with things like cleaners and such.

A friend started nudging me in the "home made" direction with things like cleaning agents for the professional pressure washing businesses we ran. For example, he'd by sodium percarbonate by the forty pound bag. Mixed with water, it produced hydrogen peroxide and soda ash for cleaning and bleaching. Think of it as using a whole lot of Oxyclean.

Then there was caustic soda for beating down moss on Northwet roofs, before pressure washing. That caustic soda gets ALL crazy when small aluminum chips are mixed in the powder and the mix tossed in a toilet.

In the end, many of these things are just things guys like us played with, found worked, then marketed, pushing [the usual] convenience and effectiveness.

 

I agree, make your own if you can, how would go about removing the debris from the wax. That is nice furniture did you make them. wonderful job

 

Haven't had to do it myself. I guess the first thing would be to liquefy the wax. That may mean dissolving it in solvent or a double boiler. After that, a T-shirt or pieces of sheet should be good enough. You might need something to squeeze the cloth with, if it's hot.

Anyone else got tips, or better guesses?

I didn't build the furniture. I just refinished them for a friend. They'd seen thirty years of use, on a large farm.

The closest I got to building in relation to it was a spindle on one of the chairs was missing. I replaced it. It was before I'd ever ran a lathe. I copied one of the others using my drill press and RotoZip, then rasps and sand paper. It took at least three hours, but I wanted to see if it could be done. It can. Of course, now that I have two lathes, I know the same job could have been done in twenty minutes, including most the finish.

 

If I ever get raw I 'll give it a try thanks Mike

 

I didn't read all the replies so maybe someone mentioned this but Hut Crystal Friction finish and Mylands Friction finish both have shellac, oil and wax in them so straight shellac should be compatible with oil and wax. I've applied both of these friction finishes after wet sanding with Howard's Feed and Wax, which is orange oil and wax, with no problems. I do clean off the slurry that forms from the wet sanding with mineral spirits and sometimes will do a light dry sanding after that with an even higher grit of paper first but not always. I have also applied a CA finish after wet sanding with Howards and cleaning the slurry with MS and had no problems there either.

 

thanks that is good to know

 

I just read through most of the other comments and have a couple of my own. If you are going to make your own paste using diatomaceous earth make sure that you do not get the kind of DE used in swimming pool filters but the kind used for gardening or as a food supplement. And make sure that the stuff from the garden center doesn't have any pesticides mixed in. The swimming pool DE is processed in a way that makes it really bad if you breath it in powder form prior to or while mixing. Or course you probably shouldn't breath the other stuff either but supposedly not as nasty if you get it in your lungs.

The other comment is probably as much a question as a comment related to mixing your own paste using mineral oil as one of the components. Since mineral oil is not a curing oil, I have to wonder if it is more likely than a oil that polymerises like BLO for example to cause problems when applying finishes later in the process? It seems like trapping some MO under another finish could be problematic for final curing or durability?

 

thanks for the warning I used food grade I am going to get some homecenter DE but for my kale. If I had that if it is ok I would use that. it good to know about the additive that might be in it. I thought mineral oil is a drying oil. I don't use it for a finish any more be it fad really fast

 

Mineral oil is considered a non-drying oil. It will evaporate over time but it does not cure and harden like BLO or tung oil do. A lot of people use it on cutting boards and in that application it mostly just washes off.

 

Lazyman, for future reference, mineral oil is called a non-hardening oil. When applied to wood, and it disapears, it is not evaporating, or drying. Rather, it is wicking deeper into the wood. It's somewhat like electricity or water, it seeks the dry/negative/empty spot.

YEARS ago, I applied motor oil to a cedar door I made for a garage, using what I found in a cedar mill spalt pile (the leavings from making shakes and shingles).

When done, I wanted the door to hold up for years, even though I was just renting. I applied the oil as I described above. At the end of the day, I walked away.

Three months later, the wannabe sunshine of Pacific Beach, Washington, kept the oil warm enough the 20-40 [or whatever] "seemed" to have evaporated. You could not tell I'd done anything. As such, I applied a second, liberal coat of non-hardening oil. This one lasted a whole three months too and, again, it looked like I'd done nothing.

I applied a third coat. Again, I was liberal in the application. Years later, you can still tell I applied the oil. This is because, rather than evaporating, the oil wicked deeper and deeper into the dry wood, just like with the butcher block.

The reason the last coat still shows is, the application of oil is cumulative, if the oil can wick. This may require heat or even thinning.

If you did a cedar roof this way, eventually, the oil would saturate the shakes or shingles. Being full of oil, they would not take on water. Too, they would remain somewhat resilient so that walking on them did not break them, as normally happens with brittle cedar.

Just handy stuff to know.

 

Better to put the shellac on first or a lacquer based sealer, then ssnding paste. Dont listen to the acks directions of sanding to 240 then using paste and calling that good. If there was a magic paste that allowed u to not have to sand up.through the grits everyone would sell it. Also beware his polish does not have much carnauba since it still is a white color. There are no white carnauba waxes in existence

 

Just for reference, my posts of polished plastic and wood, above, show turned items polished with the fake beeswax and diatomaceous mix, before any finish was applied. Only after the polish paste brought the plastic back to clear and bright did I apply a spray can lacquer finish.

 

I will add this since I have not read ALL of it.

Shellac is a great way to seal the wood and even using a few coats as a finish as well. Everything I know of will go over shellac but it will not go over a lot of other things.
I have only been using it for 10 years on wood turning and some flatwork so I can not attest to that.

Also shellac is what is part of what is Called French Polish but turners go not go thru all the same process and while turning on the lathe the heat will set it in faster also which is why a lot of Friction polishes have Shellac in it.

After a few coats of the shellac I sometimes buff with Carnauba wax and Renaissance wax last. Sometimes I put Lacquer and sometimes Wipe on Poly but with the last one does not always mix to well for some reason and sometimes it works great. I am sure it is what I am doing.

Last I would ignore WoodyJ's remarks since he has a big beef with them. See his other post for other honest people to.

 

There are no white carnauba waxes in existence

- WoodyJ

I beg to differ. Refine Carnauba wax will be a cream to white color.