I started out with a pull saw but as I got better at cutting dovetails I found it difficult to get a good feel or sight line with the small blade combined with the round handle. I bought a Veritas dovetail saw and found improvement with the increased size and pistol grip. Here is a great place to get feedback on vintage saws.
https://woodandshop.com/woodworking-hand-tool-buying-guide-handsaws/
You can make a saw vise and if you keep a few on your ebay watch list you will eventually get one cheap. A larger saw will most likely need sharpening. This works for the big rip and crosscut saws but I never had much luck finding tenon or dovetail saws. Trying to sharpen a fine tooth saw can make a preacher cuss. I bought a cheap Lynx tenon saw on amazon and it works okay for now.

 

Brindle Dog, It depends in what you are using the saw on. Breaking down large boards into rough length and width, or fine joinery. I favor the western style saws and as you might expect. The older saws I sharpen myself. The problem with Japanese style saws is that I am unable to sharpen them. I've acquired a number of old saws at flea markets etc. That have turned into real gems. Like any edged tool, a saw will require sharpening during use.
Even older backed tenon and dovetail saws often run up in the darnedest places…
Regards, The Kentucky Toolsmith!

 

As Mark Twain said, more than one way to skin a cat(fish). I use pull saws just about exclusively. Woodcraft had (has?) an amazing sale on a Ryobu for $25. I usually get Vaughn and Bushnell's that used to go for $22, but the replacement blades have gone up to $35… To me, there is NO sharpening, get another blade

There is also a handsaw thread that you should look through.
https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/302775

 

I guess it depends on what you plan to do with it. If you are cutting dovetails, I think it would better to have a nice backsaw with a little weight to it. the pull saws are e great for flush cutting, but I find mine is too flexible cutting dovetails. Look at Rob Cosman's saw with the dual pitch to it…that is the Cadillac of dovetail saws

Jim

 

I like the Gyokucho saws with rattan wrapped wood handles. I had a couple of saws with plastic handles that I felt were poorly balanced. They also had thinner blades than the Gyokucho saws.

If you want to do fine joinery the dozuki is arguably a more useful pull saw. They aren't made for ripping but they can cut dovetails well, if slower than a rip saw.

I'm a bow saw fan too. They are surprisingly nimble and good for cutting all but the really small dovetails.

 

Having grown up always using a western style push saw, I was intrigued about Japanese style saws when they really started seeing press in the late 80's, early 90's maybe? Eventually I started using them more and more. I really like them and have gotten very used to using them.

I picked up a wonderful Suizan dovetail saw a year or so ago (for about $25 brand new) and it has really become a huge part of my workflow for joinery, or accurate cuts. I've got four or five different ones I've picked up over the years, everything from my small Suizan dovetail to my Spear & Jackson construction saw.

But, I do still have the old Disstons I inherited from my Grandfather and Disston made Craftsmans I inherited from my pops. But, they definitely don't get any kind of usage compared to how often I'll reach for the pull saws.

I like the idea of the pistol grips on a lot of the high end (push style) dovetail saws. I have contemplated chasing down a pull saw with one to see if it can help me with tight joinery like dovetails. I have a coarse construction saw form Marples that is a pull saw, with a pistol style grip and I like it a lot. But, I'm thinking I'd like to try that style handle with a finer tooth count and a back reinforcement.

I honestly think if you're mostly cutting pine, poplar, alder or woods with similar hardness, you cannot go wrong with a nice Japanese pull saw. But, sometimes with hardwoods, the larger teeth of the push saws make it easier…. Although, I have sawn a lot of maple, walnut and oak with pull saw successfully.

The initial investment in a good Japanese saw is so much less expensive than a good western saw, I figure it can't hurt to give one a try!

 

I had the Vaughan bear saw, and it worked "ok", but as mentioned wasn't balanced. I bought the Gyokochu ryoba on amazon and it was night and day so much better. Better balance, cleaner cut and better tracking. I moved my vaughan saw to my construction tools. It works well for undercutting moldings and for casings for flooring etc.

For dovetails I bought a Lie Nielsen DT saw and love it. I would have probably bought the Gyokochu dovetail pull saw but i felt i should splurge on the DT saw to give me the best headstart in learning hand cut DTs.

 

Every thread I start ends up with a ton of useful information. It's really awesome!

I was googling dovetail saws and came across a sawcreekmill.org thread similar to mine. They mentioned the Zona saw and said that it is used at the College of the Redwoods. Which I assume is a renowned woodworking school. I was surprised how inexpensive they are and see that Paul Sellers has a video on correcting them.

Do you guys have a take on the Zona Saw?

Another question that I hope gets spotted down here in my thread. I watched this video:

He uses a frame saw for fast dovetails and I was blown away by how he was positioning the blade to make horizontal cuts. Does anyone know anything about this frame saw and the technique he is using to do this?
He's using the saw at 2:14 in the video.

 

We figured the wizardry out in the comments some time back, the blade starts vertical and part way down there's a twist with little teeth that goes up to full size rapidly for full cutting depth. You see him place it and do that first thrust into the wood and then he cuts with everything except the few inches of vertical blade at the front.

 

Thats not a frame saw, he actually switches to a bow saw, aka turning saw, before cutting the horizontal parts.

 

So on a turning saw you can twist the blade like a coping saw? Or is the blade itself twisted?

I ended up with the Gyokucho Ryoba and Dozuki.

 

You can sometimes find old bowsaws for $40 or so, can build kit, or buy the Gramercy:
https://toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/GT-BOWSAW12

 

I mean the saw he grabs here:

The front section is vertical and fits down in the kerf, then he angles the saw just a little to let the teeth bite so the heel of the blade will start cutting straight across the bottom of the waste, and the rest of the twist is in the blade itself.

In case those images don't work:
http://www.holzwerken.de/pics/zinkensaege1.jpg
http://www.holzwerken.de/pics/zinkensaege2.jpg