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Forum topic by SubtleEpsilon posted 05-29-2022 04:49 AM 465 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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SubtleEpsilon

79 posts in 3342 days


05-29-2022 04:49 AM

So I’ve moved in to a new home with a 1200 sqft walk-in basement that I’ve (mostly) taken over in lieu of previously taking over my 2 car garage at the previous place. I’ve had an electrician out to give me a quote and to talk about running some extra 110 outlets and add some 240 outlets. I just need to figure out where I want things before these guys show up.

Preliminary idea
So I’m installing a 100amp box over near the garage door, as shown in the pics from the 200amp box on the other side of the basement. Wood storage in the back. I now have five 240v driven tools: table saw, jointer, planer, bandsaw and dust collector. I’ve tried to keep these situated more towards the right and have the flow as miter saw, to jointer, to planer then either to table saw or bs in a rough circuit. I may have to use ceiling mounted boxes for the planer and/or bandsaw but I may be able to get away with having a wall mounted outlet for the planer if it’s agains the wall marked ‘wood area’. The bandsaw is situated next to a load bearing metal post. The square marked with the X is the gas furnace.Along the wall with the router table, drum sander, and drilll press I already have a series of 110 outlets (there’s a nice big window next to the drill press that I can put my workbench next to).

I probably won’t end up putting ducting in because I”m pretty used to moving around one of those collapsible 4” dust hoses. Don’t even get me started about the soundproofing I’m going to have to do to the ceiling…

Link to photo

-- It's a fine line between clever and stupid


15 replies so far

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SubtleEpsilon

79 posts in 3342 days


#1 posted 05-29-2022 04:51 AM

Well, picture shows up a little small, doesn’t it? Crap

-- It's a fine line between clever and stupid

View Brawler's profile

Brawler

227 posts in 1322 days


#2 posted 05-29-2022 03:37 PM

Okay first of all congrats on the new place and a wonderful 1200 sq ft to work with. You will love the walkout basement with a garage door (I have one too) however there are a few things for you to consider. First you are in the basement so if you have forced air HVAC dust and smells will go throughout the house. Second be cautious on when you open that garage door. The basement is a nice cool place to work in the summer. You are cool, and your machines are nice and cool too. So if you open that garage door on a warm humid day you will be spending the next hour or so wiping the condensation off your machines, I learned that the hard way.
I would suggest locating the wood storage area by the garage door next to your miter saw so you don’t have to shlep the boards accross the shop to cut them to workable lengths or to store them when you get new lumber. Basically swap the jointer with wood storage. Think work flow. Wood comes in, cut to length, jointed, planed, tablesaw to width, etc..

-- Daniel, Pontiac, MI

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ibewjon

3016 posts in 4285 days


#3 posted 05-29-2022 04:20 PM

And you have the furnace to deal with. Is it high efficiency with sealed outdoor air supply and plastic exhaust? Or open combustion and open flame? Fine dust can get inside and cause many problems. And too much suspended fine dust and open flame can lead to a flash fire or worse. A return air register in the basement would allow fine dust into the furnace. A nice space, just some things to think about. An open combustion water heater can also be a problem.

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NohoGerry

65 posts in 202 days


#4 posted 05-29-2022 04:39 PM

I had a basement shop in my previous home that required soundproofing-so thought I’d weigh in on the subject.

To soundproof the workshop (small 300 sq ft room in a finished basement, I had fiberglass installation installed between the floor joists. Then when it was time to have the basement ceiling drywall installed, I had Z-channels put up running perpendicular to the floor joists. Z-channels are thin metal runners (similar to the material used for drywall corners) shaped as you would guess in the form of a Z.
The drywall is installed onto the Z-channels, which hold it away from the ceiling joists, eliminating a “snare drum head” resonance issue.
The Z-channels, together with the insulation in the floor joists, reduced the machine noise to a low hum, and the rest of my family on the main floor of the house never complained when I was working in the shop.
Hope this is helpful to your planning effort.
Gerry

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bigJohninvegas

1225 posts in 2954 days


#5 posted 05-29-2022 05:21 PM

Well, I read some sound advise here, so not much to add. The order your machines are in sounds about right for work flow. But as you add your electrical, think about mobility. My shop has finally settled down into a semi permanent or intended to be permanent layout. But it changed many times over a couple of years to get there.

At the time that I added electrical in my shop, I only had 110v tools. So I put 2 gang outlets all over, with two separate circuits. One on the left, and one on the right in each box. My DC is 110v, and always running at the same time as the other tools. So it is never sharing a circuit.
Later on when I bought my band saw, I had to add the 240v. At the same time I converted my table saw to 240v as well. And I opted for a single 240v circuit and outlet. As you mentioned you already have several 240v tools, so I am sure you won’t make that single outlet mistake I did.
I would add several 110v ceiling outlets, and 240v if you think you need them there. As you mentioned some tools
may need that center of shop power. As for the 110v, think hanging air cleaner, and retractable power cord reel.
Is your work bench against a wall out out in the middle. Overhead power is very convenient, and removes the trip hazard of extension cords to power hand tools.

-- John

View SubtleEpsilon's profile

SubtleEpsilon

79 posts in 3342 days


#6 posted 05-29-2022 06:15 PM



Okay first of all congrats on the new place and a wonderful 1200 sq ft to work with. You will love the walkout basement with a garage door (I have one too) however there are a few things for you to consider. First you are in the basement so if you have forced air HVAC dust and smells will go throughout the house. Second be cautious on when you open that garage door. The basement is a nice cool place to work in the summer. You are cool, and your machines are nice and cool too. So if you open that garage door on a warm humid day you will be spending the next hour or so wiping the condensation off your machines, I learned that the hard way.
I would suggest locating the wood storage area by the garage door next to your miter saw so you don t have to shlep the boards accross the shop to cut them to workable lengths or to store them when you get new lumber. Basically swap the jointer with wood storage. Think work flow. Wood comes in, cut to length, jointed, planed, tablesaw to width, etc..

- Brawler

Good point about the condensation, I’ll have to keep an eye on that. It’s a bit more damp here than the last place, but we’re still up about 3000’ so maybe that’ll help ameliorate it. I did think about having the wood closer to the miter saw. I’ll have to think about that. Given the walk from the driveway at the front of the house and down to the garage door in the back of the house, I think I’m already walking the wood a lot. :-)

-- It's a fine line between clever and stupid

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SubtleEpsilon

79 posts in 3342 days


#7 posted 05-29-2022 06:25 PM


https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/318128#
And you have the furnace to deal with. Is it high efficiency with sealed outdoor air supply and plastic exhaust? Or open combustion and open flame? Fine dust can get inside and cause many problems. And too much suspended fine dust and open flame can lead to a flash fire or worse. A return air register in the basement would allow fine dust into the furnace. A nice space, just some things to think about. An open combustion water heater can also be a problem.

- ibewjon

That’s a fair point I hadn’t thought about. There is a plastic exhaust on the side of the house and there is a (currently) unfiltered return air duct in the basement (see photo). I know where the filter is in the furnace box but this would clearly need a filter in front of it would think. You can see that in the image here. The exhaust to outside goes out to the left (kind of hidden by the joists)

-- It's a fine line between clever and stupid

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ibewjon

3016 posts in 4285 days


#8 posted 05-29-2022 07:01 PM

Some furnaces have sealed combustion, where the intake air is solid pipe to the burners. My boiler has the intake air piped in to where the gas mixes in and goes directly to the burner. I have seen some where the supply air is piped into the furnace cabinet, but not actually sealed. Just there to be available if needed, and the unit can still draw combustion air from the house .

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Brawler

227 posts in 1322 days


#9 posted 05-31-2022 02:21 PM

Make sure you have an excess of lighting plus task lighting. I don’t know how old you are, but take it from me when you get older you never have enough light.

-- Daniel, Pontiac, MI

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ibewjon

3016 posts in 4285 days


#10 posted 05-31-2022 02:31 PM

use two circuts for lighting, and no receptacles on those circuts.

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Knockonit

1286 posts in 1694 days


#11 posted 05-31-2022 02:45 PM

and just when you think you have enough, add somemore, easy not to use if not needed, but hard to add later.

i had electrician wire my accordingly since i had only so much amperage to use. had opposite walls be on same circuit, since i’m a one man or two person shop, chances of me working on opposite sides of shop were nil.

just allowed me to have quite a few outlets. and i put 220 outlets at least a couple per wall, some same circuit some not.

good luck, i’m still figuring out my final layout, seems like i figure out a way to squeeze another few sq ft for use after some organizing and finalizing the flow.
my big deal is the dust collection, layout, i’m close, but still moving machines to make my moves less, being older i find short spaces are ok. lol
rj in az

-- Living the dream

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Sark

485 posts in 1852 days


#12 posted 05-31-2022 02:55 PM

+1 on z channel for ceiling drywall. Rock wool is a little better at sound absorption than fiberglass, if you can get it without too much trouble. Lots of information out there re: sound isolation, and lots of specialty products. Worth a bit of study before committing.

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RDan

222 posts in 3816 days


#13 posted 05-31-2022 05:00 PM

Looking at your photo, it looks like a great space. I would suggest that before the ceiling you seal your ductwork with duct seal or aluminum tape. It makes a difference in the system performance. See if you can build a small room for the furnace. Make sure you allow a vent for make up air, which can have filters as well. Also, the walls should have at least, a larger door, or make one wall removable to allow a new furnace or Water heater to be installed, it also helps in the removal as well. Dan

View yamato72's profile

yamato72

57 posts in 447 days


#14 posted 05-31-2022 05:29 PM

Congrats on the new space. Lots of good advice here. I dislike moving DC hoses between tools so even though you say you don’t mind, maybe give some thought to how you would run a trunk diagonally across the ceiling to accommodate future drops to tools. The catch with moving a DC hose around is there is always one single operation to do that you don’t bother with (same with making that one cut without putting on the safety glasses or hearing protection).

For actual advice, I’m going to recommend against obstructing access to your 100A panel. Your miter saw will go there long after the final inspection is done, but you are typically required to keep a refrigerator-footprint-sized space in front of your panel.

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ibewjon

3016 posts in 4285 days


#15 posted 05-31-2022 10:10 PM

+1 on the rock wool/mineral wool for better soundproofing. And it is a code violation as well as a safety hazard to block your electrical panel. And that clear spar runs up to the ceiling. No ducts or plumbing or shelves in that space.

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