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Forum topic by Karda posted 05-16-2022 04:27 AM 543 views 0 times favorited 16 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Karda

3422 posts in 2047 days


05-16-2022 04:27 AM

Hi I have some kiltz that is getting old, can I use it for sealing end grain, it is an alcohol based stain sealer similar to Bin primer


16 replies so far

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MrUnix

9045 posts in 3693 days


#1 posted 05-16-2022 09:00 AM

AFAIK, the original Kilz was oil based, and then they came out with a VOC friendly water based formula, which is basically the same as latex. Either should be fine for sealing end grain. I don’t think I’ve ever seen one that was alcohol based, so that might be a different animal than what I’m thinking of. I just use old latex paint, and prefer white so I can write on the piece the type of wood and date harvested with a black marker.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

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bondogaposis

6193 posts in 3845 days


#2 posted 05-16-2022 12:51 PM

I’ve used it with good results.

-- Bondo Gaposis

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Karda

3422 posts in 2047 days


#3 posted 05-16-2022 03:24 PM

thanks I must have been mistaken, I just assumed. I figured I might as well used it it is just going bad

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Knockonit

1291 posts in 1696 days


#4 posted 05-16-2022 06:09 PM

i tried using left over ext, latex paint, but alas, here in desert where no humidity most of year, it was marginal. still a lot of major cracking and shrinkage, but mother nature will provide other options on pcs, later on.
gonna keep trying stuff to see what works best here in this climate
rj in az

-- Living the dream

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CaptainKlutz

5750 posts in 2988 days


#5 posted 05-16-2022 07:13 PM

IME – The wood surfaces dry so fast in Arizona, you have to paint the ends immediately after felling, or they have already cracked a few hours later. Also, latex does not seal AZ DRY end grain well. The wood absorbs the water in latex, and prevents significant sealing.

I use oil based primer, random left over enamel, or thinned down ‘old’ polyurethane; when I need to seal end grain. The oil base takes longer to dry, absorbs further into wood, and appears to seal better.

One of my Sawyer’s swears; it’s Anchorseal (oil base solvent emulsion and wax), or nothing; as all other solutions behave like no sealer was used in our single digit humidity.

When I first learned to buck/saw logs as kid on giant saw driven by wide belt and PTO on tractor; farmer that owned the saw, used to heat linseed oil and paraffin wax to seal ends of large beams. Normal lumber slabs were never sealed.
Laughed when I recently noticed Osmo selling another expensive oil/wax product, called end grain sealer. Anyone can make oil/wax blend dirt cheap. Hot plate and coffee can is all equipment you need. Farmer used an old camp stove. :) Sometimes old school is best.


i tried using left over ext, latex paint, but alas, here in desert where no humidity most of year, it was marginal. still a lot of major cracking and shrinkage, but mother nature will provide other options on pcs, later on.
gonna keep trying stuff to see what works best here in this climate
rj in az

- Knockonit


-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, Doom, despair, agony on me… - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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Karda

3422 posts in 2047 days


#6 posted 05-16-2022 08:18 PM

a lot of what is for sale is convenience

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Lazyman

9779 posts in 2881 days


#7 posted 05-16-2022 10:06 PM

I have never had luck using latex or oil based paints to seal end grain so that it doesn’t crack. No mater which one or how much I apply, the ends always crack within a day or two. The only thing that works for me, and it works very well, is Anchorseal. I have tested latex paint and Anchorseal applied at the same time immediately after cutting on opposite sides of the same cut and the painted one cracked overnight while the Anchorseal one was still uncracked several months later.

BTW, the Rockler version called Green Wood End Sealer is exactly the same same stuff as Anchorseal but is about half the price. If you pull up the SDS from Rockler on their Green wood end sealer, they give you the Anchorseal SDS and it looks and performs identically to Anchorseal.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.

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xedos

559 posts in 794 days


#8 posted 05-17-2022 01:55 AM

FYI – Kilz does not have an alcohol / shellac based primer similar to BIN.

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azwoodworker

95 posts in 3276 days


#9 posted 05-17-2022 04:35 AM

Like CaptainKlutz states getting the wood sealed fast is key in Arizona. I have had a lot of success with Old Latex. Flooring latex is the best result. I have not used Achol stain sealer similar to Bin primer and did not know they made it with alcohol. Primer seals but does not coat over preventing air. Anytime I tried primer it failed. Latex enamel has worked well. I managed to get eucalyptus to dry without cracking or warping using two or three coats of old latex paint and some other tricks. Just primer never. You can’t get a thick enough coat to prevent air movement.

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TheDane

6060 posts in 5157 days


#10 posted 05-17-2022 01:50 PM

I use PVA drywall primer … about $12 a gallon at most home centers. I apply 2 coats and get excellent results.

The key is PVA … Polyvinyl Acetates. PVA is used in many wood glues, and is a clear, odorless, rubbery polymer that helps to seal up the wood pores.

-- Gerry -- "I don't plan to ever really grow up ... I'm just going to learn how to act in public!"

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Karda

3422 posts in 2047 days


#11 posted 05-17-2022 03:46 PM

ok thanks

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OSU55

3050 posts in 3483 days


#12 posted 05-18-2022 08:14 PM

I use pva glue, usually TB2, no thinning, brush on heavy coat.

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Karda

3422 posts in 2047 days


#13 posted 05-18-2022 09:37 PM

thats what I was using before I got the end grain sealer I am almost out of. might just go back to that

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ibewjon

3026 posts in 4287 days


#14 posted 05-18-2022 10:29 PM

The alcohol based primer/sealer is rated as a vapor barrier for homes like mine that so not have a vapor barrier. It wasn’t a thing in 1915. But, yes, if what you have is the alcohol base primer, it will work. It is very thin. I buy anchor seal direct from the manufacturer in 5 gallon buckets. I will check the rockler price to compare. Thanks.

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bigJohninvegas

1228 posts in 2956 days


#15 posted 05-20-2022 02:09 AM



i tried using left over ext, latex paint, but alas, here in desert where no humidity most of year, it was marginal. still a lot of major cracking and shrinkage, but mother nature will provide other options on pcs, later on.
gonna keep trying stuff to see what works best here in this climate
rj in az

- Knockonit

I have found here in the Vegas desert, that tite bond 2 wood glue makes a great end grain sealer. and I buy a gallon of it at a time anyhow. So I always have it on hand. The logs pictured are about a month old. I left them 2 to 3 feet long. I have had better success not cutting them into a usable size till I need them.
Milky yellow glue dries semi clear.

This tree fell over in a wind storm. Turns out it was dying. Base of the tree was heavily spalted.
Smaller branches, and some of the spalted pieces I dipped in hot wax. but in a few months I am going to stabilize them with cactus juice. we will see how the small logs with wax as a sealer works here.
Oh, the glue as a sealer stores well outside in the shade. Where all the waxed items will have to be kept in the shop. to hot here for the wax to be outside for sure.
Here is a waxed piece. time will tell how well it works. But plenty of store bought blanks come this way.
If you choose wax. A $5 dollar yard sale electric fry pan, and old candles. Or paraffin wax off amazon is what I used.

-- John

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