LumberJocks

#4 Bailey Hand Plane

  • Advertise with us

« back to Hand Tools forum

Forum topic by fisherdoug09 posted 09-21-2021 10:18 PM 527 views 0 times favorited 13 replies Add to Favorites Watch
View fisherdoug09's profile

fisherdoug09

128 posts in 3917 days


09-21-2021 10:18 PM

Hello and appreciate any ideas and help from you expert hand plane guys. I received three old hand planes after my father in laws passing. I have a #4 Bailey, #5 Stanley both with corrugated soles and a #7 Bailey smooth sole. And have the #4 restored. Never having used more than a block plane I went to my local woodworking tool store. I needed help putting it back together and adjusted correctly. We discovered the sole right below where the frog sits is not drilled and tapped for the frog adjusting screw. This can’t be a normal thing. Any ideas how to fix it, I sure would like to use it.

Thanks
Doug


13 replies so far

View TechTeacher04's profile

TechTeacher04

476 posts in 2774 days


#1 posted 09-21-2021 10:51 PM

That is normal, the early planes did not have that adjustment screw and the some of the newest ones have had that omitted to save cost. Paul Sellers has many great videos on the assembling and adjusting vintage planes, a quick youtube search will yield a lot of information

View AlanWS's profile

AlanWS

164 posts in 4801 days


#2 posted 09-21-2021 10:54 PM

My recommendation is to just use it. The frog adjusting screw makes it easier to move the frog forward or back before you lock it down and never move it again. Just put the frog where you want it and leave it there. If you do need to move it, you will need to spend an extra 30 seconds. Don’t destroy the plane trying to fix a non-issue.

Make sure you clean up and try using all the planes before you do any extensive “restoration”. In my experience with Stanleys from 1960s and earlier, only about 1 out of 15 needs more than cleaning and sharpening to work well. To get a smoother into tiptop condition might take a little sole flattening, but blindly grinding it is as likely to hurt as help.

Clean up and use all three. They will probably work well enough to be very pleasing, and if one does something another does not, you will be in a better position to ask how to make the others behave that way.

-- Alan in Wisconsin

View SMP's profile

SMP

4830 posts in 1148 days


#3 posted 09-21-2021 11:30 PM



My recommendation is to just use it. The frog adjusting screw makes it easier to move the frog forward or back before you lock it down and never move it again. Just put the frog where you want it and leave it there. If you do need to move it, you will need to spend an extra 30 seconds. Don t destroy the plane trying to fix a non-issue.

Make sure you clean up and try using all the planes before you do any extensive “restoration”. In my experience with Stanleys from 1960s and earlier, only about 1 out of 15 needs more than cleaning and sharpening to work well. To get a smoother into tiptop condition might take a little sole flattening, but blindly grinding it is as likely to hurt as help.

Clean up and use all three. They will probably work well enough to be very pleasing, and if one does something another does not, you will be in a better position to ask how to make the others behave that way.

- AlanWS

Yep, a 4 is a smoother. Set it to smooth and leave it. I mean, if the 5 is your ONLY plane then being able to adjust the 5 would be useful. but you have a smoother. I would set the 4 to cut fine, and put a nice camber on the 5 iron.

View Chip201's profile

Chip201

11 posts in 31 days


#4 posted 09-22-2021 04:18 AM

Brings a smile to me when I hear about old planes. One Friday a lady that grew up with my sister dropped by my office with a box of 4 or 5 planes. She said,” look at ‘um, clean ‘um, play with ‘um, and pick out 1 or 2 if you want. See you later” well, I did all weekend. By Sunday afternoon, I had 2 that I wanted to buy, so I taped them off and sprayed painted appropriately, flattened & shined the exposed metal, and polished the totes and knobs and sharpened the blades. Monday I took them back to the office and spread them out on my desk as a display. I told her which two I wanted. As she looked at them she noted that I had left the splashes of green or yellow paint on those planes. I told her because her father had used those ugly odd splashes to mark them as his. And if he had cared them, then so would I.

View Don W's profile

Don W

20180 posts in 3810 days


#5 posted 09-22-2021 03:32 PM

I tend to find the frog adjustment screw annoying. If it’s not just right can be more of a pain than it’s worth, but I’m a Sargent guy, they didn’t bother on their Bailey type.

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

View Ocelot's profile

Ocelot

3396 posts in 3881 days


#6 posted 09-22-2021 05:28 PM

Pictures! Need pictures!

-- I intended to be a woodworker, but turned into a tool and lumber collector.

View drsurfrat's profile

drsurfrat

1029 posts in 429 days


#7 posted 09-22-2021 05:47 PM

^ what ocelot said

Also, the frog adjustment screw was skipped during WWII, so it probable means that it is from that era. Also notable might be a coarser lever cap, non-rosewood knob and tote painted black, and a plastic depth adjusting wheel (tho not necessarily) for the WWII type.

-- Mike (near Boston) ... Laziness is the mother of invention, necessity is the mother of exhaustion - me

View Ocelot's profile

Ocelot

3396 posts in 3881 days


#8 posted 09-22-2021 06:22 PM

Type 8 and earlier also lacked those screws … and I think two-tone and I know four-square lacked them.

I have a four-square household jack without the screw.

Defiance also lacked them.

-- I intended to be a woodworker, but turned into a tool and lumber collector.

View OSU55's profile

OSU55

2830 posts in 3232 days


#9 posted 09-23-2021 06:59 PM

Nothing wrong, many dont have the frog adj screw. I dont adjust frog position. A properly dressed chip breaker adj for distance from the edge is the proper adj when adj depth of cut. Tight 5-10 thou for smoothing, up to a 1/16 or so for roughing. Plane tuning here.

View Francisco Luna's profile

Francisco Luna

1050 posts in 4636 days


#10 posted 09-23-2021 08:58 PM

Frog Adjuster Screw – Stanley introduced a mechanism to make longitudinal adjustments to their frogs in 1907. At the rear of the raised seat on the bed of the plane to which the frog is attached, a bolt-like screw was added. Called the frog adjuster screw, it engages the adjuster tab that was added to the bottom rear of the frog. By turning this screw, the frog could be moved forward or backward, the effect of which was to open or close the throat of the plane. This feature was present on all Stanley planes from 1907 on, although there were a few examples made during WWII that are found missing the both the adjustment hardware and their mounting holes.”

That being said, your plane was produced before 1907….does it have lateral adjustment lever?
You could have a real gem in your hands, As a basic restoration rule, “Do not do anything on the tool that is not reversible.”....I would love to see pics!

-- "Menos es mas" Ludwing Mies Van Der Rohe

View Ocelot's profile

Ocelot

3396 posts in 3881 days


#11 posted 09-23-2021 09:00 PM

OP hasn’t been back since the first post, so we are talking to ourselves.

-- I intended to be a woodworker, but turned into a tool and lumber collector.

View Don W's profile

Don W

20180 posts in 3810 days


#12 posted 09-23-2021 11:33 PM

And the adjustment screw was not found on all Stanley planes from 1907 on, just all Stanley-bailey planes. Several of the other Stanley lines did not have them (basically because you don’t really need them).

He says to himself

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

View BugeyedEarl's profile

BugeyedEarl

10 posts in 49 days


#13 posted 10-05-2021 01:50 PM



OP hasn t been back since the first post, so we are talking to ourselves.

- Ocelot

Good point, but isn’t that what the internet was invented for? Another possibility that occurred to me, is that Doug might have a frankenplane with a replacement frog from who-knows-where, that has the yoke for the throat adjustment screw. I could see how that would lead to some confusion.

Have your say...

You must be signed in to reply.

DISCLAIMER: Any posts on LJ are posted by individuals acting in their own right and do not necessarily reflect the views of LJ. LJ will not be held liable for the actions of any user.

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

HomeRefurbers.com