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Forum topic by StevoWevo posted 07-26-2021 10:57 AM 613 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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StevoWevo

26 posts in 62 days


07-26-2021 10:57 AM

Hello everyone??, I’m mostly a lurker and not a full time wood worker by any means. However, I do have experience with what I would call rough carpentry. I’ve done a fair amount of framing and interior/exterior trim work etc. I would like to gravitate towards more refined work as much of my past experiences seem to be better suited for younger folks lol. On to the point. I have been gathering a few modest hand tools over the past past year or so. I have been using automotive sand paper and the film sets from taytools for the few plane irons and (cheap) chisels. It’s been ok but a bit cumbersome so I decided I would like to try a combination of diamond/water stones. I have gathered a Trend 300/1000 diamond stone and sigma power select2 stones in 6000 and 13000. I’m not sure if I need any intermediate stones such as 3000 for example. I have the veritas guide as well. I am hoping I can use the trend for establishing primary bevels and maintenance flattening for the other stones. Do I need a coarser stone to establish a secondary micro-bevel? Also is there any special procedures for new stones or some kind of break-in? I have plenty enough paper/film left to temporarily fill any holes in the line up and help with flattening the backs of any near future tool purchases. Hopefully I’m on the right track or at least close with what I have so far. I understand this subject can lead down many rabbit holes from my online reading. Nonetheless open to any and all input. TIA!


15 replies so far

View dbw's profile

dbw

610 posts in 2849 days


#1 posted 07-26-2021 12:05 PM

I believe there are numerous threads on LJ relating to hand tool sharpening. It sounds like you are all over the map on this subject. If there is a Woodcraft store near you you might consider taking their sharpening class. Having a Veritas guide is a good start. It is very easy to over-think this subject (many people have).

I have 220, 1000, 4000, and 8000 water stones and a Veritas guide. I get all my chisels and plane irons ‘wicked sharp’ with just these, including flattening the backs and adding micro bevels.

If your tools are in poor shape you can start by using course (courser than 220) wet/dry paper attached to glass (using spray adhesive).

There is no need to “break-in” stones. Make sure you use all areas of the stones otherwise you’ll create ruts. Get a flattening stone for your water stones.

I hope this helps.

-- Woodworking is like a vicious cycle. The more tools you buy the more you find to buy.

View Kudzupatch's profile

Kudzupatch

275 posts in 2421 days


#2 posted 07-26-2021 12:43 PM

Loaded question and all that matters is the results. If you can sharpen a chisel to where it will shave your arm you have a sharp chisel. How you get there is up to you.

FWIW i use a power sharpener with 3 (water) stones. I have a REALLY coarse one I only use to grind out nicks or clean up an abused blade. 95% of the time I used the other two. One to shape and one to get the final edge. I don’t bother with secondary bevels and I am happy with the results. What you do can be totally different if it works for you.

-- Jeff Horton * Kudzu Craft skin boats* www.kudzucraft.com

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StevoWevo

26 posts in 62 days


#3 posted 07-26-2021 12:54 PM

Of course I’m all over the map, Did you see my screen name? (jk) I appreciate your advice but I don’t have any real woodworking stores where I am. Dbw, would you mind telling me which of your stones you set the micro-bevels with

View LittleBlackDuck's profile

LittleBlackDuck

7891 posts in 2033 days


#4 posted 07-26-2021 02:29 PM

Welcome to LJ StevoW.

While I’ve been trying to woodwork for a few years, I consider myself a “competent” hacker and rely on technological advancement to try to compete with some of the veterans you will encounter here at LJ’s.

I started with the stones, graduated to ”diamonds” and finally settled for a Tormek...

I don’t know your financial position, however, if it is limited, I sincerely suggest you abandon woodworking… the cost of timber is getting inhibitive without a private source and even simple hand tools can get expensive… then come the big boys… we all start small, get cocky and go BIG ($$$).

Many swear by stones, diamonds or even sandpaper, yet many eventually graduate to mechanical means. There are a number of great sharpening systems out there, however, I can only speak of what I’ve used and that is the Tormek.
Shekels permitting, it will put a dent into your budget but there are few edge tools in your workshop. household or garden that it cannot sharpen/hone repeatedly to a constant precision… even big drill bits.

If you fall into the category of “looks good and maybe one day”, consider opportunity costs… you may spend a small fortune for initial workarounds and eventually spend what you thought you were saving… just about guarantee that in 6 months time you can’t look at your bank statement and say “there that money I saved in not buying the Tormek”!

-- If your first cut is too short... Take the second cut from the longer end... LBD

View bbc557ci's profile

bbc557ci

634 posts in 3287 days


#5 posted 07-26-2021 02:39 PM

I rely mainly on 4 grits of diamond stones and a Veritas guide to keep the edges sharp. My old Delta wet wheel is sometimes put into action too. I try to keep it simple and straight forward.

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

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LittleBlackDuck

7891 posts in 2033 days


#6 posted 07-26-2021 03:46 PM



I rely mainly on 4 grits of diamond stones and a Veritas guide to keep the edges sharp. My old Delta wet wheel is sometimes put into action too. I try to keep it simple and straight forward.

- bbc557ci


Sorry 557ci, I still have my stones and Veritas guides (even made a box for them)... I also bought a different branded ”Delta wet wheel” for just the wheel as the whole lot was less than a Tormek wheel. The stones are hidden, the Veritas is warehoused in some cupboard and a friend got the ”Delta” as a freebie as the price of the unit indicated the quality of the wheel.

Just saying, in case the OP might get (future) tempted by a Tormek and I’m trying to save some shekels in the prelim.

-- If your first cut is too short... Take the second cut from the longer end... LBD

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Peteybadboy

3880 posts in 3162 days


#7 posted 07-26-2021 05:00 PM

Stevo welcome to LJ’s

I also have the Veritas guide 1000/4000 diamond plates and 8000 water stone. Final is on the 8000, and the flip the brass thingy on the Veritas and micro bevel.

I will lap (flatten) on 750 diamond plate

-- Petey

View SMP's profile

SMP

4715 posts in 1118 days


#8 posted 07-26-2021 05:20 PM

well since you already have what you have, then that will work just fine. i would just add a strop(leather or cardboard) and some green compound from HF. me personally the highest i go is 8k stone and that is what i use to make my microbevel(hence micro)

View controlfreak's profile

controlfreak

2730 posts in 814 days


#9 posted 07-26-2021 05:26 PM

Started wet wet stones but hated the mess that splattered about.
Moved to PSA on float glass but don’t like the move in only one direction to not tear the paper.
Got a worksharp and like the speed I can touch up my chisels but I worry that I am going to mess up my wide plane irons with it.
I am planning on getting some diamond stones to play with and will probably use the work sharp for correcting angles and fixing major chips. The diamond stones for maintaining the edges.

View Smitty_Cabinetshop's profile

Smitty_Cabinetshop

17506 posts in 3831 days


#10 posted 07-26-2021 05:31 PM

What you’ve done previously, along with the diamond stones you have now, should do fine. My suggestion is one I’ve read from others pretty consistently over the years: be consistent. Come up with your process and stick with it for a good while before jumping to something else. And then jump if what you’re doing isn’t meeting your needs.

That said, the strop suggestion fromSMP is a good one. Paul Sellers shows how to use one and it’s a step I’ve adopted for final finish as well as occasional touch-ups.

I don’t use secondary bevels, FWIW.

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. - OldTools Archive -

View Phil32's profile

Phil32

1558 posts in 1116 days


#11 posted 07-26-2021 06:23 PM

Your “sharpening strategy” is fine for what you describe, but it’s only applicable to plane blades, bench chisels, and other straight cutting edges. How do you use it for carving or turning gouges, curved knives, drill bits? How do you use a Veritas guide on a Sitka gutter adze? Broaden your perspective.

-- You know, this site doesn't require woodworking skills, but you should know how to write.

View Aj2's profile

Aj2

4029 posts in 3011 days


#12 posted 07-26-2021 07:47 PM

I was actually thinking the same as Phil. A mature woodshop or woodworker sharpens many more tools then a common house chisel. Or a plane blade.
Turning tools ,Carving tools ,marking knives jointers knives axes chainsaws. The list goes on.
Good Luck stay the course

-- Aj

View dbw's profile

dbw

610 posts in 2849 days


#13 posted 07-26-2021 09:53 PM



Of course I’m all over the map, Did you see my screen name? (jk) I appreciate your advice but I don’t have any real woodworking stores where I am. Dbw, would you mind telling me which of your stones you set the micro-bevels with

- StevoWevo


Norton 8000 git water stone. It only takes a few strokes. The 4000 will work as well.

-- Woodworking is like a vicious cycle. The more tools you buy the more you find to buy.

View StevoWevo's profile

StevoWevo

26 posts in 62 days


#14 posted 07-27-2021 08:21 AM

Man, you guys are awesome, thanks for the warm welcome and your advice.
Good deal dbw, appreciate it Little Black Duck, I think what you are saying with the Tormek is right in line with the ole “buy once, cry once” A lot of the time I agree with this but I just wasn’t sure how far I was going to go with hand tools. I’m still not sure, for now it’s mostly ancillary and experimental. SMP, thanks. I will try the cardboard and look into picking up a strop. Seems like most people go with the green compound?
Controlfreak, I decided to move away from the paper/psa for the same issues that you mentioned in your reply. I will keep all that stuff tucked away for now as back up.
Phil and Aj, I do have a small lathe hiding in a corner. Unfortunately I just don’t have the time or space to start learning it. Hopefully in the future. I’m still doing quite a bit of work on the house we moved into two years ago.
Kudzupatch, bbc, Petey, Smitty thanks for weighing in and taking the time to give me your thoughts.

View SMP's profile

SMP

4715 posts in 1118 days


#15 posted 07-27-2021 02:41 PM



Man, you guys are awesome, thanks for the warm welcome and your advice.
Good deal dbw, appreciate it Little Black Duck, I think what you are saying with the Tormek is right in line with the ole “buy once, cry once” A lot of the time I agree with this but I just wasn’t sure how far I was going to go with hand tools. I’m still not sure, for now it’s mostly ancillary and experimental. SMP, thanks. I will try the cardboard and look into picking up a strop. Seems like most people go with the green compound?
Controlfreak, I decided to move away from the paper/psa for the same issues that you mentioned in your reply. I will keep all that stuff tucked away for now as back up.
Phil and Aj, I do have a small lathe hiding in a corner. Unfortunately I just don’t have the time or space to start learning it. Hopefully in the future. I’m still doing quite a bit of work on the house we moved into two years ago.
Kudzupatch, bbc, Petey, Smitty thanks for weighing in and taking the time to give me your thoughts.

- StevoWevo

the compound doesn’t have to be green. but it works and is readily available. if you have blue or brown on hand those should work, just not red as thats what i use for fine polishing gold. there is a chart here to explain compounds, just note that plane irons and chisels are hardened so behave differently than mild steel etc:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polishing_(metalworking)#Equipment

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