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Forum topic by Woodson59 posted 09-12-2020 05:46 AM 527 views 1 time favorited 13 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Woodson59

42 posts in 2013 days


09-12-2020 05:46 AM

Topic tags/keywords: finishdecisions japanese joints funwithjoinery

Ok I’m about ready to finish this joker. So I’m leaning wipe on poly.
Laquer doesn’t like booze and shellac doesn’t like water. My brothers condensating whiskey glass will go on there and be spilled. I don’t want to build up the drawers, the drawer sockets are tight. Thinking wipe on on the drawers and base, Also drawer cubbies/sockets, whatever you actually call that, done in wipe on to not build that up, but would like end up with me doing wipe on on the whole case.

Then I would spray the upper case and drawer fronts with a higher gloss traditional poly. Then wax and rub everything out. Should end up with contrasting finishes for a texture element going from satin to semigloss.

Any issue with thinnered down poly hypothetically with extra linseed oil on a surface before spraying traditional? Any suggestions in products? Maloof wipe on? Min wax? The Semi gloss upper coat. I haven’t ever found an oil based poly I’m that happy with. Varathane? Old masterS? Min wax marine?.

Just looking for suggestions before I cap off 200 hours of work poorly then sand down and try again three times per usual


13 replies so far

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ChefHDAN

1772 posts in 3732 days


#1 posted 09-12-2020 11:42 AM

OB Poly can yellow a bit, you may want to just stick with a WB wipe on poly, you can get them in a gloss, I usually stick with satin and then apply a coat of paste wax about a week or so later

-- I've decided 1 mistake is really 2 opportunities to learn.. learn how to fix it... and learn how to not repeat it

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CWWoodworking

1092 posts in 1061 days


#2 posted 09-12-2020 12:05 PM

Can you just spray precat lacquer? Seems like it would check all the boxes.

View MPython's profile

MPython

308 posts in 695 days


#3 posted 09-12-2020 07:40 PM

Wipe on poly is a tough finish but it often ends up looking like plastic. I use it for shop furniture and such, but not for fine furniture. Your piece is very nice. If it were mine, I’d want to finish it with something that accents the wood and shows it off. My favorite finish for this kind of thing is Waterlox Original. It tough, easy to apply and gives you more of an “in the wood” finish appearance. I wipe it on, but it can be sprayed as well. If the wood is prone to blotching, I always start with a thin wash coat of 1lb cut of dewaxed shellac, sanded lightly, as a base. It helps prevent unsightly blotching.
Nice piece. Good luck with the finish.

Python

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Woodson59

42 posts in 2013 days


#4 posted 09-16-2020 02:01 AM



Can you just spray precat lacquer? Seems like it would check all the boxes.

- CWWoodworking


I’m asking,please enlighten me. I remember reading forums a few years back and came to the conclusion for a lush polyurethane was the way to go, but that was a few years back on a wine rack. I thought laquer didn’t like water? And shellac didn’t like alcohol, but I was thinking for look and rapid build up I’d love to do a de-waxed shellac and laquer it. I just want a finish that lasts a lifetime and impervious to my brother

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Woodson59

42 posts in 2013 days


#5 posted 09-16-2020 02:06 AM



Wipe on poly is a tough finish but it often ends up looking like plastic. I use it for shop furniture and such, but not for fine furniture. Your piece is very nice. If it were mine, I d want to finish it with something that accents the wood and shows it off. My favorite finish for this kind of thing is Waterlox Original. It tough, easy to apply and gives you more of an “in the wood” finish appearance. I wipe it on, but it can be sprayed as well. If the wood is prone to blotching, I always start with a thin wash coat of 1lb cut of dewaxed shellac, sanded lightly, as a base. It helps prevent unsightly blotching.
Nice piece. Good luck with the finish.

Python

- MPython

I don’t ever think water based gives the chatoyance I want. But does shellac first fix that? Maple on this is all Birdseye or curly and I don’t want to muddle the pop

View BurlyBob's profile

BurlyBob

7946 posts in 3148 days


#6 posted 09-16-2020 02:08 AM

I contacted Charles Neil about my kitchen cabinets a few years back. I used natural danish oil to bring out the character of the wood. He recommended that I use a light shellac followed by a water based poly. I had purchased an Earlex spray rig. Everything Mr. Neil told me worked like a champ. It’s become my go to process for any big project.

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CWWoodworking

1092 posts in 1061 days


#7 posted 09-16-2020 02:16 AM

Can you just spray precat lacquer? Seems like it would check all the boxes.

- CWWoodworking

I’m asking,please enlighten me. I remember reading forums a few years back and came to the conclusion for a lush polyurethane was the way to go, but that was a few years back on a wine rack. I thought laquer didn’t like water? And shellac didn’t like alcohol, but I was thinking for look and rapid build up I’d love to do a de-waxed shellac and laquer it. I just want a finish that lasts a lifetime and impervious to my brother

- Woodson59

Pre catalyzed lacquer is different than standard lacquer. It has decent resistance to alcohol and water. It’s not bullet proof though.

Basically if you spill something or a glass sits for a couple hrs it’s not gonna hurt it. Start leaving a glass in the same spot every night and don’t clean it, you will have issues.

It does have a mil limit so you can’t build endlessly. 2-3 coats and your done.

It is flammable and toxic. Take safety measures. As you should with all coatings.

And please don’t use shellac as a sealer with it. It doesn’t sand as well as lacquer and is simply not needed. Plus it is weak against alcohol.

View OSU55's profile

OSU55

2658 posts in 2872 days


#8 posted 09-19-2020 02:14 AM

Precat lacquer would work well. If you cant spray OB poly would be my next choice. Thin it 1:1 and apply like danish oil. For the top you can wipe on or brush, after 2 coats applied as above, for film thickness. Use satin and rub up to the desired gloss. Imperfections are hidden by the satin finish. “Plastic look” is caused by too thick of a film and hi gloss, with any finish. Its not just poly.

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ChefHDAN

1772 posts in 3732 days


#9 posted 09-19-2020 11:27 AM

Woodson
I have to agree with OSU55, applied right I have pretty much always used poly for the protection with 3 kids growing up over the past 20 years. My preferred method is a satin WB poly mostly always sprayed straight from the can using the $20 HF HVLP gun. 3 light coats can usually be applied in a day as they dry very quickly. For final finish I use either #0000 wool or a synthetic. Last step is about 2 applications of the same paste wax I use on the tools. I never really have had to worry about a piece after the poly coat and I have not had to fix a water ring boo boo on any of my pieces but almost always on anything I’ve bought to clean up/restore/repair.

For the best “pop” of the chatoyance on your final figure, see “Charles Neil’s video on “Trace Coating””:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjTSIiUiEOI I’ve used this method several times and for well figured woods IMO I think it gives the best results to final product

-- I've decided 1 mistake is really 2 opportunities to learn.. learn how to fix it... and learn how to not repeat it

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MPython

308 posts in 695 days


#10 posted 09-19-2020 01:21 PM

\
I don’t ever think water based gives the chatoyance I want. But does shellac first fix that? Maple on this is all Birdseye or curly and I don’t want to muddle the pop

- Woodson59

Woodson,

I’ve never used a shellac wash coat with a water base finish, so I can’t answer your question. I have used it with poly on curly maple and the end result had really nice chatoyance. If you go this route and want a satin finish, I recommend using an initial wash coat of 1# shellac, lightly sanded with 320 or 400 grit paper will pop the grain a little and help prevent blotching. It should improve the chatoyance. Follow with several coats of gloss poly and use satin for the final coat. Satin poly has silicon platelets suspended in the finish to deflect the light and kill the gloss. They are invisible to the naked eye, but with repeated coats, they build up, obscure the grain and give you a bit of a muddied appearance. Gloss doesn’t have the suspended platelets so it doesn’t muddy the grain. A final coat of satin over several coats of gloss will give you a nice satin end result without dulling the grain. Again, I don’t know if this works with a water based finish.

Python

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ChefHDAN

1772 posts in 3732 days


#11 posted 09-19-2020 01:25 PM


Woodson
For the best “pop” of the chatoyance on your final figure, see “Charles Neil s video on “Trace Coating””:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjTSIiUiEOI I ve used this method several times and for well figured woods IMO I think it gives the best results to final product

- ChefHDAN

Link repaired see the video here, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjTSIiUiEOI

-- I've decided 1 mistake is really 2 opportunities to learn.. learn how to fix it... and learn how to not repeat it

View OSU55's profile

OSU55

2658 posts in 2872 days


#12 posted 09-21-2020 05:18 PM

Yes shellac can be used under a wb finish to provide chatoyance. I have done it many times. Not as good Of chatoyance as solvent finishes but it does work. Just doesnt have quite as much “brilliance”. If using a semi or satin finish it wont matter much.

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Woodson59

42 posts in 2013 days


#13 posted 09-27-2020 05:34 AM

Having just visited their place with a lot of Period correct mid century modern pieces. That was the design cue I wanted to make an ode to joinery on, but it all looks hand rubbed and barely built up.

Durable hand rubbed favorite finishes go?

Y’all all seemed to speak to the typical piano finish we all strive for and I’ve hit with high gloss oil based poly then semi then waxinf it out grit after grit. I wanna try some of your methods, but after looking at their real Nordic impressive pieces I realized that’s not the look I’m supposed to do..

Rubbed on finishes. Durable best product? Plastic look aside I can sand wax that out.

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