My hope was to have a square reference that could be clamped to but not have to treat it like a beating heart. My engineers squares are hidden away and I have some 123 blocks but I am not quite care free with them. I bought these clamping squares with the hope of throwing them around and grabbing them as needed. But they were not square, and they flexed, and yes they were BORG purchased and reasonbly cheap, $12. They were manufactured in halves and seamed together which was also off, I put them on my mitre station tops I built before these arrived and used them as a reference to how square I build things and they were off and flexed to easily. My 3 square references I have all agreed to the same thing, they were off on the inside, off from side to side (different half) and off a little worse on the outside (appx 3/64 in 8").
But maybe I was expecting to much, what should we expect from clamping squares, flex no flex, you get what you pay for and there are better, or, for clamping squares that is the norm? Or just maybe you might say use a square rule and forget clamping squares. The idea of being able to clamp to something square would be a great help aligning things, that was my hope. Some will say make your own, probably out of wood, but I have to ask does moisture effect wooden tools created for accuracy?
I have some small clamping squares that are machined steel and I made some large ones from 3/4" plywood. They both do what I expect which is act as clamping aids. Plywood is stable enough that I trust them to stay square. All that said though, they are just clamping aids. Whatever I'm clamping needs to be square during dry-fit or fixed prior to glue up.
To your point, if they flex too easily, they aren't much good. There are some good metal versions available and there are plans available to make your own. They are handy things to have around for sure.
BTDTGTTS
Bought some Rockler clamping squares when they came out. Same problem.
Took them back to store, along my trusty engineering square and was only able to find 2 out of ~12 that were square. Store ordered some more, the next lot was ~50% square. The 'bad' ones were more like 89° with measurable 0.010-0.020" gap near corner on one leg.
They also flex to much IMHO. Using them for large boxes is dangerous. Can easily bend a leg and make case out of square.
My review on Rockler site showing they were not square and how easy the bend was removed. My complaint to corporate folks got me a dear klutz letter with the advice that if not happy with purchase, can return to store for refund.
I made clamping squares like the video in four sizes. They were made from a double layer of 3/4" Baltic birch and they work great. Boxes I make with them check square with my engineering squares. Cheap, rugged and square!
Those gaps would be depressing if you spent a lot of cash on them Pretty easy to make from plywood, or you can buy some.
Simple Cove shows how to use plywood to make them. Actuially a lot of video is available doing this same thing, and I imagine a lot of posts here as well.
If you see these sold solo, and they don't cost too much, get one, and try a known good square against it. A 10 pack of them is 43 bux at Amazon. You can get smaller, less expensive angles for construction that come square, most you can bend, but if you don't they work. Again it's fun to bring in a small engineers square that you know is a good 90*, and just check them, most are dead on.
Agree 100% that if you pay for square, it should be square. Discussion over. No excuses.
With that said, I am curious about what you're working on. I think I do a good job in my craft but have never found the need to be dead-on square in woodworking. I have a simple metal square I picked up somewhere along the way. I use that with a couple corner clamps, and have never had an issue. I will say I have wrestled with some larger table frames in the past, but always seems to work out. Just curious as to why this accuracy is needed.
@becikeja "" Just curious as to why this accuracy is needed.""
I am new to woodworking and once you learn how something is supposed to be, you look back on the way you did things and see how bad they were. I can't draw a stick figure very well and I can't draw a straight line. Now I am trying to go the other way. Without much experience, I thought that errors would multiply, so I am trying to teach myself to be accurate, how much ? I have no idea !!
Thanks everyone, I will build some and keep an eye out for others as I need them.
P.S. There is a lot of finite "accuracy" (.0001) used (talked about) for tuning blades and saws, so I guess in my learning I thought it was supposed to be "that" accurate maybe. Also, I kind of like getting that accurate, it is unusually satisfying.
I don't know what size of work you're doing but in addition to clamping squares, you might consider some 1-2-3 blocks. They're precise and rock solid and pretty affordable. You could use them for clamping glue ups but there are infinite ways they can be used in the shop.
I have them, but admit I have been kind of protective like my engineers squares. As I was just thinking how to screw two 123 blocks together and get them tight without any head exposed ? They also don't seem to reach out far enough. Maybe I should try 246 blocks !!
I got some rockler ones that attach to some clamps. I didn't expect much as the reviews were littered with "out of square" but hey they are plastic. I think of them as more of an extra set of hands for building plywood boxes and such. Anything I build that is needing to be dead on will likely have some joinery that a well placed clamp can pull square.
Generally you don't need precision from the inside of a square. Did you measure the outside?
I have those same Rockler clamping squares and although not perfect, they're good enough. I can flex a 1/2" plywood panel more than the amount of error you're showing. Many ply panels will have a bit of warpage. What matters isn't if the temp clamp fixture is perfect, but is the final result ok.
The square and fence make an assembly corner.
I use them as a 3rd hand to keep things from falling over during assembly. I check my stuff for square using the diagonals test. I don't use four clamping aids and call it good enough. These are NOT "layout" squares.
Are your woodworking skills so fragile that the error you're showing impacts your cabinets?
NONE of our tools are perfect. Part of the art of wood working is being able to do precision and quality with less than perfect tools/materials.
Use them for what they are, cheap, injection molded, clamping "mostly squares" and don't demand perfection from low cost plastic.
kinda like metal measuring squares. There is the homeowner quality level, "construction" quality, and engineering/machinist quality. You do get what you pay for and I'm in the camp of using your own shop made units or find things around the shop (pieces of angle iron/aluminum, parts of old machines, etc.)
They are injection molded whole, in one piece. The seams you see are where the two mold halves meet.
The mold halves may have been misaligned, giving the appearance that the two product halves were "joined together" misaligned.
This can happen when the mold halves's alignment features are worn, usually from excessive use. Replacing molds is expensive, so using them past their lifetime saves money.
The out-of-square condition is likely due to the improper curing of the molded parts after they are removed from the mold, and/or being removed from the mold too quickly (another misguided approach to maximizing production and minimizing cost).
Checking molded products takes time, and costs money.
I should also note that it is difficult to mold products with two opposing, parallel sides. It makes ejecting the product from the mold more difficult. So they could make the inner surface square and flat, or the outer surface square and flat, but making them both square and flat gets expensive.
OldBull I can appreciate your answer. I'm an engineer by education so I get the stress of precision. Woodworking is my get away from the stress. I really stressed about accuracy when I started and got frustrated then learned that 99.9% of the people that love my pieces never see the errors I see in every piece. Now I'm not saying I accept shabby, and I'm not saying I accept good enough. The engineer in me will not allow it. But I no longer stress about every little flaw and have grown to love this hobby. Good luck with your squares, but don't forget to enjoy the ride along the way.
I really stressed about accuracy when I started and got frustrated then learned that 99.9% of the people that love my pieces never see the errors I see in every piece.
- becikeja
sam maloof said in an interview that every piece he has ever made has a mistake in it.
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