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Can you use shou sugi ban with edge joined panels?

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Forum topic by Lazyman posted 06-02-2020 08:09 PM 421 views 0 times favorited 7 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Lazyman

5446 posts in 2164 days


06-02-2020 08:09 PM

Topic tags/keywords: douglas fir panels cupping char burn edge joining finishing hide glue

I am thinking about using a shou sugi ban (charred wood) finish on some quarter sawn Douglas fir boards but I need to make some wider panels because the boards I have available to me are only about 3.5” wide. I did a trial on a scrap piece just to see the result and it looks good but I am worried about doing this with glued panels. First I am worried that if I burn the the panel after glue up, the heat it will either compromise the glue joints (I’ve been using liquid hide glue on this project so far, if that makes a difference) or cause the panel to cup or otherwise warp due to moisture loss on the treated side. These are going to be drawer fronts so I suppose I could treat the other side in hope that will undo any cupping? If on the other hand I treat each board before I glue up the panel, cupping is still a concern but I wonder if I will be able to avoid charring the edges making it hard to to get a good glue joint and if I run it through the jointer or through my table saw to clean it up after burning, I worry that unburned wood might show through.

Anyone have any experience with this on a glued panel? Theories are welcome too.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.


7 replies so far

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recycle1943

4501 posts in 2399 days


#1 posted 06-02-2020 10:19 PM

I have not seen 1/4 sawn DF but anything else I’ve seen that was 1/4 sawn doesn’t need any help being attractive. That’s the extent of my experience of charred wood – sorry : (

-- Dick, Malvern Ohio - my biggest fear is that when I die, my wife sells my toys for what I told her I paid for them

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Holbs

2346 posts in 2806 days


#2 posted 06-03-2020 12:10 AM

Try out a sample piece. I did charred wood for my plantation shutters before glue up cause didn’t know any better. The charring only happens on the surface. I would bet, has little noticeable affects on an existing glue line.
Better yet…char a glue line. Let is rest to cool. If you do not let rest, the brushing ashes will be held in the glue making the glue line very visible. I’d bet cooling before brushing would work.

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

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duckmilk

4193 posts in 2101 days


#3 posted 06-03-2020 02:28 AM

I agree with trying it out on some small sample pieces. However, Hide glue will become soft (or liquid) upon heating. That’s how you can safely take apart hide glued surfaces.
What about taping the edges with blue painter’s tape first to minimize the burning of them and then glue them.
How thick are the boards? Thicker ones should have minimal cupping, and/or you can burn them in increments to achieve the desired amount of char.

Edit: I sent you a text about the madrone. Did you get it?

-- "Duck and Bob would be out doin some farming with funny hats on." chrisstef

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Lazyman

5446 posts in 2164 days


#4 posted 06-03-2020 04:13 PM

Whoops Duck. I got sidetracked and forgot to respond to your text.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.

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Lazyman

5446 posts in 2164 days


#5 posted 06-03-2020 04:18 PM



I have not seen 1/4 sawn DF but anything else I ve seen that was 1/4 sawn doesn t need any help being attractive. That s the extent of my experience of charred wood – sorry : (

- recycle1943

I sort of agree. This will be for a chest that fits under my lathe to store most of my turning tools and supplies that is also made from QS DF. I am just exploring ideas for making the drawers of the cabinet have a contrasting front but I might just stick with with the natural look. The vertical grain of the ship lap I put on the back of the cabinet does look pretty nice.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.

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Lazyman

5446 posts in 2164 days


#6 posted 06-05-2020 10:17 PM

Just following up. I found a cutoff of a panel and did a burn test just to see how it would do. The surface definitely contracted and very small gaps opened up at the joints. I then stressed each of the joints and every one of them broke fairly easily except the one I didn’t burn. On that one the wood broke before the joint. On one of the joints I only lightly charred and the break there started with the joint and the rest held so that the break continued diagonally. I did notice that one of the boards in the middle cupped pretty badly, the others didn’t. I really like the look it gives but this is not the right application.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.

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Foghorn

519 posts in 163 days


#7 posted 06-06-2020 12:38 AM



I agree with trying it out on some small sample pieces. However, Hide glue will become soft (or liquid) upon heating. That s how you can safely take apart hide glued surfaces.
What about taping the edges with blue painter s tape first to minimize the burning of them and then glue them.
How thick are the boards? Thicker ones should have minimal cupping, and/or you can burn them in increments to achieve the desired amount of char.

Edit: I sent you a text about the madrone. Did you get it?

- duckmilk


In the absence of moisture, hide glue will resist heat a lot better than almost all glues. I’m just speaking from the aspect of guitars left in a hot car where most glues will move, but not hot hide.

-- Darrel

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