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Dust Collector, CV1800 vs Oneida Supercell

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Forum topic by jgt1942 posted 05-19-2020 05:21 PM 1163 views 2 times favorited 41 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


05-19-2020 05:21 PM

Topic tags/keywords: dust collector

I’m looking at the CV1800 with the 16” impeller and the Oneida Supercell dust collectors and would appreciate your comments. I have a 17×55 shop with an adjoining 23×28 area. The two rooms are accessible via a 13 1/2’ x 10 1/2’ opening. Later I may wall off this opening and install an oversize barn-door. Currently, I plan to service just the 17×55 area with DC, the other area is supposed to be the garage but is now overflow.

Tools to be serviced, Tablesaw, bandsaw, router table, drum sander, planner/joiner, Rigid Oscillating Edge/Belt Spindle Sander, portable tools (track saw, router, various hand sanders). Later I plan to add a large edge/belt sander.

I’ve read through Bill Pentz’s website. In my former shop, I used a 2HP HF with a Thien Top Hat. It seemed to work great and serviced my needs. I sold the unit when I moved.
Thanks, JT

-- JohnT


41 replies so far

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

6326 posts in 3303 days


#1 posted 05-19-2020 05:38 PM

I haven’t heard of the Supercell until now, so I looked it up. IF it’s what they describe it’s one incredible machine. The description seems to indicate it’s the cat’s meow for all the uses you plan.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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AndyJ1s

363 posts in 565 days


#2 posted 05-19-2020 08:19 PM

I would check the recommended dust collection CFMs for at least your sander, planer/jointer, and the new edge sander you want.

If the Supercell meets each of those needs, and you will only be running one machine at a time, it will likely handle the others just fine.

I am expecting shipment of a Felder Hammer A3-41 16” jointer/planer combo, and its recommended airflow is right on the edge what the Supercell can do, but well within my Mini Gorilla’s curve.

Review Pentz’s information on minimum air velocity in the lines to keep the dust and chips in suspension. With the fairly low CFM on the Supercell, you do not want to use ducting with too large a diameter, else the velocity will drop and dust may drop out of the airflow. This would be a bad problem if it occurs in long vertical drops between the machine port and the ceiling. They recommend no larger than 5” ducting for the Supercell. Note that the pic/video of them testing 100’ of 4” duct showed they used the duct on the floor, with very little vertical lift. And it did not include collecting dust from a tool with a small, restrictive port.

Oneida has an article on guidelines for choosing between the Supercell, and one of their larger, conventional DCs: https://www.oneida-air.com/blog/v-system-vs-supercell

The article may help inform your decision.

Note that both of your choices, ClearVue and Oneida, are manufactured in the USA!

-- Andy - Arlington TX

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jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


#3 posted 05-19-2020 08:40 PM



I haven t heard of the Supercell until now, so I looked it up. IF it s what they describe it s one incredible machine. The description seems to indicate it s the cat s meow for all the uses you plan.

- Fred Hargis


Fred, I agree, the SuperCell seems to be a super machine “but” it also seems to be too good to be true. The low CFM has me really worried.
My ports will range from 1 1/2” to 4”. If I get the CV1800 I was going to run a 6” feed down the long wall of my shop, almost end-to-end. I’mm guessing that run would be about 45 feet. At some areas I would run across the ceiling to the other side of the shop. The ceiling is 12’ thus height is not an issue for me other than it is more pipe and extends the run. If I get the supercell most runs would be 4” lines.

-- JohnT

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Redoak49

4813 posts in 2798 days


#4 posted 05-19-2020 08:58 PM

I would go with the CV1800 for your shop. It pulls significantly more cfm than the 465 for the Supercell. While the higher vacuum is great, you really need the higher cfm.

I have an Oneida which is similar rating to the CV1800 piped with 6” pvc and similar tools. If interested , look at my blogs for specific information on the performance of my system. I use a Festool HEPA vac for sanders and such where I need higher vacuum levels.

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CausticGuy

16 posts in 1329 days


#5 posted 05-20-2020 01:45 AM

I just purchased the v3000 and actually set out to buy the Supercell over the v3000 but Onieda recommended the V3000 when I mentioned my drum sander the possibility of upgrading my dewalt 735 planer to a 3 or 4 hp planer in the near future. I was surprised because i was intrigued by the supercell but went with their suggestion. They did also say the v3000 is quieter. My space is about 17×25 with some storage and finish space separated.

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clagwell

282 posts in 602 days


#6 posted 05-20-2020 09:50 AM

I put together a chart for another thread where the OP was trying to compare the Supercell to the V3000. I’ve added the CV1800 to that chart:

At the smallest hose size the Supercell clearly outperforms the CV. It’s also better at the 2.5” size but not by as much. For 4” port tools the CV has a big advantage.

For the smallest hose size a shopvac will do at least as well as the CV. Also, using the CV at low flow rates reduces the separation efficiency of the cyclone sending more fine dust to the filters.

-- Dave, Tippecanoe County, IN --- Is there a corollary to Beranek.s Law that applies to dust collection?

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jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


#7 posted 05-20-2020 05:22 PM

Andy, Great suggestion regarding the CFM. I must be brain dead and never thought of checking this.

My Delta Drum Sander 31-255X (not the best drum sander but it was free) recommends 400-600. I remember when I connected my modified HF not a lot of the dust was collected. Thus now I know the reason.

I have the Felder Hammer A3-31 requires 500CFM also pushing the limit of the SuperCell. BTW I have an issue with joining, my fence will tilt a few degrees and so far I have not found the solution to stop it. I’ve locked everything as best I can but still, it will tilt and will not be square to the bed. I did NOT get the quiet head and have been kicking myself the past few months.

My router table is a unit by itself and so far any DC I’ve connected to it does not do a good job.

My bandsaw is a 20” Jet with a 4” port, dust collection is sorta OK but not great.

Based on the above feedback I’m very much leaning toward the CV 1800 with the 16” impeller.

-- JohnT

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jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


#8 posted 05-20-2020 05:36 PM

Dave, MUCH thanks for the chart and comments.
I’m very much leaning toward the CV1800 and as you suggest I’ll just use a shopvac (with a thien baffel or dust deputy) for the smaller lines.

In my previous shop, when I converted the HF with the thien tophat baffle I put it on wheels thinking I could move it to the different machines as needed but I had too many tools for the space and ended up just running a flex pipe from the DC to the various tools. I also ran a fixed line from the house central vac with a drop (flex hose) to my main work area for the track saw and similar tools, this took care of the smaller diameter line. In our current house, we do not have a central vac so I will just use the shopvac.

-- JohnT

View Redoak49's profile

Redoak49

4813 posts in 2798 days


#9 posted 05-20-2020 05:37 PM

I think that a 5 hp CV or Oneida would work well for your application.

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

6326 posts in 3303 days


#10 posted 05-20-2020 05:38 PM

If you go with the CV1800, I can offer some first hand observations…I have one with the 16” impeller. I have a 19/38 DS, an MM16 BS, and my table saw (SS) has an Excalibur over blade pickup. The DC is exceptional on these with 6” trunk lines. Even the Excalibur overblade (which has a 3” connection) is good. So there’s little doubt it will handle your large machines and do it very well. But I suspect if you try choking it down (I’ve not do it, just guessing) to 2.5” or less, it’s performance will suffer….and you did mention hooking it to your portable tools. I do as Clagwell suggested and use a shop vac on my small stuff. In the past with a different DC, I did try using it with my hand tools and as a floor vac…it was awful. So my admiration of the Supercell is when it offers the small tool hookup. But on my tools, if there is any possible way to do so, I open the ports up to 6” so I can run the larger line right to the tool. It’s not possible on my TS, DS, or combo sander, but most everything else has 6”. The only drawback to the CV 1800 in my book is the noise. Mine runs at 94 dB by itself…add in the other tool and it gets pretty loud.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


#11 posted 05-20-2020 05:39 PM

Redoak49, much thanks. I have the Mirka sander with their vac and LOVE it. I have used the vac on other tools but it is a bit of a pain removing the sander and attaching it to another tool. I need to look for a simpler method of moving the vac to another tool. For now I will just use my shopvac with a Thien tophat for the smaller tools. Possibly I will be happy with it and not need something else.

I greatly appreciate all the feedback and suggestions, everything has been super helpful.

-- JohnT

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jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


#12 posted 05-20-2020 05:47 PM

Fred, much thanks! I was concerned about the noise level as well. In my previous shop, I walled in an area for my HUGE air compressor and when I closed the door it was MUCH quieter. I have not done that in my current shop and I get a lot of noise from the wife, LOL! I can easily create a walled-off area for both, e.g. the air compressor and the CV1800. I realize that the CV needs to draw air from the shop so on one wall I will install a baffle to reduce the noise and still allow air to flow. This does reduce efficiency a bit, how much I don’t know but it will help with the noise. I will use rock wool on the inside of the wall, currently thinking of no drywall on the inside of the wall.

-- JohnT

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tvrgeek

1008 posts in 2459 days


#13 posted 05-20-2020 07:44 PM

I know nothing about it, but Harvey has a couple of new offerings that apear different from normal.

View jgt1942's profile

jgt1942

262 posts in 2698 days


#14 posted 05-21-2020 02:29 AM



I know nothing about it, but Harvey has a couple of new offerings that apear different from normal.

- tvrgeek


??

-- JohnT

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

6326 posts in 3303 days


#15 posted 05-21-2020 12:21 PM


I know nothing about it, but Harvey has a couple of new offerings that apear different from normal.

- tvrgeek

??

- jgt1942

I think Geek was referring these DCs.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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