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Forum topic by bbandu posted 11-13-2019 12:44 AM 1002 views 1 time favorited 43 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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bbandu

139 posts in 2106 days


11-13-2019 12:44 AM

I have been debating what dust collector to get. Even though I really did not have a budget I wanted to try and get the most bang for my buck.

I did quite a bit of thinking when it came to purchasing the dust collector.

I decided to get the:

Harbor Freight 2 HP 1550 CFM Dust Collector
Adding a MERV 15 (.5 micron) canister
Adding a 12 in. Diameter Rikon impeller
Add Dust Deputy Cyclone to make it 2 stage

I was able to do all of the upgrades (filter cartridge and impeller) plus add the Dust Deputy Cyclone for less then $750

Here are some of the ones that I compared it with. (price and advertised performance)

(I used comparison before Dust Deputy added: Cost $540)
Jet $549.99
1 HP 650 CFM Dust Collector
2-Micron Canister Kit
9.5 in. Diameter impeller

(I used comparison after Dust Deputy added)
Jet $749.99
1.5 HP 1100 CFM Dust Collector with Vortex Cone
2-Micron Canister Kit
11 in. Diameter impeller

(I used comparison after Dust Deputy added)
Jet $799.99
2 HP 1200 CFM Dust Collector with Vortex Cone
2-Micron Canister Kit
12 in. Diameter impeller


43 replies so far

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bbandu

139 posts in 2106 days


#1 posted 11-19-2019 01:46 PM

Ok so over the last couple days a had alittle time to work on my DC system. I filter and motor have been mounted (meed to add some safety straps to the motor), the cyclone is complete (went with a 60g pickle barrel instead of the blue barrel because the cyclone fit it perfect)

Please let me know if you have any suggestions that might make things better or even easier.

Really the only thing left is to connect everything and start running the piping

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EarlS

3311 posts in 2910 days


#2 posted 11-19-2019 02:24 PM

I’m in the process of doing the same thing with a Delta 50-850, a 0.5 micron pleated filter canister, and a SDD XL with 6” inlet/outlet to match up to the 6” inlet on the fan housing. Hopefully, in the next couple days it will be finished and I can post a blog on it. Since the Delta was used and I didn’t upgrade the impeller, my cost is ~$650.

What are you planning to put under the filter to catch the fines – a bag or a container?

-- Earl "I'm a pessamist - generally that increases the chance that things will turn out better than expected"

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bbandu

139 posts in 2106 days


#3 posted 11-19-2019 02:45 PM



What are you planning to put under the filter to catch the fines – a bag or a container?
- EarlS

Right now the plan is to just use a short bag, with the cyclone I am not expecting alot if fines.

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EarlS

3311 posts in 2910 days


#4 posted 11-19-2019 06:23 PM

When I initially tried things out the bag was billowing about an it was really noisy so I put a cutoff plastic barrel under the filter and it cut down the noise quite a bit.

-- Earl "I'm a pessamist - generally that increases the chance that things will turn out better than expected"

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bbandu

139 posts in 2106 days


#5 posted 11-19-2019 07:16 PM



When I initially tried things out the bag was billowing about an it was really noisy so I put a cutoff plastic barrel under the filter and it cut down the noise quite a bit.

- EarlS

Post a pic so we can see. I would also like to leave my compressor there and its alittle easer to move a plastic bag out of the way then a bucket/barrel.

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Fred Hargis

5837 posts in 3055 days


#6 posted 11-19-2019 07:21 PM

Go without a bag, just blank off the filter with a wooden circle. Truth is that most of the fines that get into the filter get packed into the folds of the media, only a very small amount of them fall to the bottom.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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bbandu

139 posts in 2106 days


#7 posted 11-19-2019 07:23 PM



Go without a bag, just blank off the filter with a wooden circle. Truth is that most of the fines that get into the filter get packed into the folds of the media, only a very small amount of them fall to the bottom.

- Fred Hargis

ok nice to know.

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pintodeluxe

6016 posts in 3375 days


#8 posted 11-19-2019 08:30 PM

I would strongly recommend getting a wall mounted cyclone. Get one that was factory designed. I just don’t think any of those options will even approach the performance of a tall cyclone.

Suction and separation will suffer with the other units.

Look for an old Tempest cyclone, or a used Oneida.

The 650 cfm Jet is worthless. I am a fan of Jet tools, but I got rid of that one as soon as possible.
The bigger Jet D.C. could get you by for awhile.

-- Willie, Washington "If You Choose Not To Decide, You Still Have Made a Choice" - Rush

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clagwell

56 posts in 354 days


#9 posted 11-19-2019 10:13 PM



Go without a bag, just blank off the filter with a wooden circle. Truth is that most of the fines that get into the filter get packed into the folds of the media, only a very small amount of them fall to the bottom.

- Fred Hargis


That is correct. A properly functioning cyclone should pass very little material to the filter and, as you said, most of it ends up in the filter.

There is a downside to that approach. Closing off the bottom will add static pressure loss. I haven’t measured that exact configuration but I have tested a Thein style baffle on the bottom of that collector ring, which should be very close in performance. The baffle adds 1.6” loss at 400CFM. In terms of equivalent pipe length that’s 20’ of 4” PVC. The solid cover could be more or less than that but is likely close.

Another thing I see here is the use of the original collector ring as a filter mount. That collector ring adds 1.2” at 400CFM compared to feeding directly into the top of the filter, like most commercial cyclones do. That’s another 15’ of 4” PVC.

-- Dave, Tippecanoe County, IN

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fivecodys

1532 posts in 2198 days


#10 posted 11-19-2019 10:38 PM

First of all, asking questions on this forum is the best way to start. These guys were very helpful to me when I was designing and laying out my system.

A couple of suggestions.
1. Go Google Bill Pentz. This guy has a lot to say about dust collection and it’s all worth the read.

2. Keep the inlet into the cyclone a straight as possible. min 5 feet if you can. You want the most efficient flow of air as it enters the cyclone. If it’s too turbulent as it enters the cyclone, it can lose some cfm’s as it crashes into the air flow inside of the cyclone. Imagine one spinning clockwise and the other counter-clockwise and them coming together. The cyclone will win the battle but it will lose some of it’s velocity. (Again Read Bill Pentz)

3. No 45 deg sharp elbows. You want gentle sweeping curves. Every-time the air has to turn a corner it loses velocity.

With a small system, every little bit counts. Mine works so well that I can vent my exhaust directly outside to the flower bed with no dust build up on the bushes at all.
This came about not from me but from the collective wisdom on this forum.

-- When you leave your shop for the night, make sure you can always count to 10.

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Fred Hargis

5837 posts in 3055 days


#11 posted 11-20-2019 11:28 AM


There is a downside to that approach. Closing off the bottom will add static pressure loss.

- clagwell

I find that a little hard to understand, if you test it I would be interested in the results. The bottom will be closed off anyway, by the bag. How would eliminating the bag increase SP loss?

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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clagwell

56 posts in 354 days


#12 posted 11-20-2019 12:14 PM


There is a downside to that approach. Closing off the bottom will add static pressure loss.

- clagwell

I find that a little hard to understand, if you test it I would be interested in the results. The bottom will be closed off anyway, by the bag. How would eliminating the bag increase SP loss?

- Fred Hargis

Fred, I think the issue is where the bottom is closed off. The bag allows a much larger sweep to the turn the air has to make in order to go up into the filter.

When I was testing the Thein style baffle I found that loss was very sensitive to the vertical position of the baffle. The lower the baffle the less loss. Remember that the top of the separator ring is dished downward. This leaves a sharp edge and reduced clearance when a solid bottom is added.

As I said, my actual test of the baffle showed a 1.6”@400CFM loss with the baffle mounted as low as possible, i.e., top surface of the baffle just slightly above the lower edge of the ring. The only difference between that and a solid cover is the 3/4” wide slot around 2/3 of the circumference.

-- Dave, Tippecanoe County, IN

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EarlS

3311 posts in 2910 days


#13 posted 11-20-2019 01:17 PM

If you watch the fines billowing about in the bag, it is obvious that all of the turbulence will result in some pressure loss. That makes sense for a normal DC since the only way to keep the dust in the bag is to slow the dust/air flow below the settling velocity. The settling ring (or thein baffle as you mentioned) helps slow things down and keeps the dust in the bag.

I wonder if a spiral separator ring that would direct the airflow into the filter section would work for a 2-stage with a cyclone. Consider that Clear-Vue dust collectors only have a small fines collector below the filter section on the fan outlet. All of the air goes directly into the filter section. Their approach would lead me to consider that the filter could be mounted below the transition, rather than above it, with a collection/access pot under the filter that would be used to remove the fines when the filter is cleaned off, eliminating the entire issue of the bag under the filter and the turbulence.

-- Earl "I'm a pessamist - generally that increases the chance that things will turn out better than expected"

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Fred Hargis

5837 posts in 3055 days


#14 posted 11-20-2019 01:30 PM

It still seems to me that if you see the turbulence in the bag, using a blank would reduce that…so if anything reducing SP loss. But whatever it does, I’d bet you would need some really sensitive instruments to measure the difference. But I’m just speculating…to me, this wouldn’t even be worth the time to test it (if I had what was needed).

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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TheRock

23 posts in 2818 days


#15 posted 11-20-2019 02:02 PM

I am working on building a new shop and dust collection has been on my mind as well.
I added an equipment closet for my dust collector and air compressor. This closet has a louvered vent to the outside, and an opening into the shop. I can vent to the outside or back into the shop depending upon the weather. The opening into the shop is designed to accept 20” square furnace filters. I can also plug either or both holes to insulate against the weather or sound as the case may be.

When Mt. St. Helens erupted back in May of 1980 none of the cars could keep going. The ash was plugging their air filters. State troopers had to keep stopping and cleaning their air filters. When they spotted a guy who was able to keep on the road when nobody else could, the pulled him over and asked him how he did it?

It seams that he borrowed his wife’s panty hose and put them over the air filter. It worked nicely.
All the state troopers headed off to buy panty hose for their cars.

When I get my dust collection system installed, I am going to try panty hose as a filter. They are cheep, easy to clean and I imagine that there is nothing quite like a pair of panty hose (double barrel wind sock) to dress up your shop.

-- TheRock

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