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Update - Easiest route to "Scary Sharp City"?

6K views 96 replies 34 participants last post by  chrisstef 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Now that I'm using my chisels more often I'm looking for the easiest (cheapest) way to keep them sharp.

Lots of techniques out there. I just want a simple way to get the job done. Not looking to buy a Tormek or diamond wheels for my slow speed grinder that i never use. I've got a fine and corse stone that came with another set that I bought years ago. I have a 600 grit diamond hone that I use for my skew and carbide turning tools and sheets of sandpaper up to 1200 grit. (not that I can't get more easily enough). I've seen people use 3 grits of wet sandpaper on a piece of glass.

Sharpening is worse than sanding to me but I see how my results have improved since receiving a set of scary sharp swiss chisels which aren't as sharp now that I've been using them. (they're still sharper than my original set though) I had access to a Tormek for a while but no longer but these swiss made ones were sharper than my original set even after using the Tormek. Preferably I'd like to only sharpen them a few times a year and just use a hone to keep them sharp like my turning tools that go back to hair shaving scary sharp after 30 seconds with the hone and maybe some MDF or leather.

Suggestions needed please.
 
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#4 ·
Tormek is for grinding a new bevel when the chisel is damaged or you want a different bevel angle. I wood use what you have and add a 6000-8000 grit water stone. And I have the Veritas mk II guide system either because I'm weak or precise depending on who you talk to ;)

Keep your low speed grinder, it's very good for new bevels at 20% the cost of a tormek. Great for sharpening lathe chisels too.
 
#8 · (Edited by Moderator)
As they say, harder steel will hold an edge longer but is more difficult to get a good edge on. Likewise, softer steels are easier to get sharp (and sharper in my experience) but have to be sharpened more often. My cheapest chisels ,that I got from Harbor Freight to be beaters, tend to be my sharpest chisels and actually hold an edge pretty well even though I abuse them more. I don't like to stop and sharpen so my solution to is to buy multiple of sets of them and then sharpen them all at once so you have one long sharpening session rather than having to do it weekly. I have also picked up some other no-name chisels at garage sales. I typically just use the wet/dry sandpaper method for my marathon sharpening sessions and I have actually gotten pretty good at just doing it by feel without a guide which makes it go a lot faster. When you are sharpening 10+ chisels at a time, it gives you lots of practice. Paul Sellers has a pretty good video about sharpening without a guide. I have an MK II but rarely use it because it pretty much doubles how long it takes for me.
 
#9 ·
+1 on jbmaine's suggestion for granite surfaces and sandpaper. I have two 12" square granite floor tiles for lower grits and two Woodcraft granite blocks for the higher ones. The sandpaper is stuck down with spray adhesive. I also use the Veritas Mk. II honing guide and a bit of camellia oil on the paper. Touchup between full-on sharpenings is just hitting the finer grits.

I'm finishing up building a set of custom storm doors out of white oak and have a much greater appreciation for how nicely a sharp chisel will shave that wood with just a push of my hand.
 
#10 · (Edited by Moderator)
BTW, if you buy a granite tile, check it pretty carefully. Some of them naturally have small pits that you will definitely feel as you are sharpening. I personally don't like using a spray adhesive to hold down the paper. I always seem to get clumps and bumps under the paper and then you have to clean off the plate when you change the paper. I typically just use a spray bottle and wet both side of the paper so that the water holds it to the granite and frequent squirts also helps float the swarf away. If you use a guide, the guild also helps keep it from moving.
 
#11 ·
Now that I m using my chisels more often I m looking for the easiest (cheapest) way to keep them sharp.

Lots of techniques out there. I just want a simple way to get the job done. Not looking to buy a Tormek or diamond wheels for my slow speed grinder that i never use. I ve got a fine and corse stone that came with another set that I bought years ago. I have a 600 grit diamond hone that I use for my skew and carbide turning tools and sheets of sandpaper up to 1200 grit. (not that I can t get more easily enough). I ve seen people use 3 grits of wet sandpaper on a piece of glass.

Sharpening is worse than sanding to me but I see how my results have improved since receiving a set of scary sharp swiss chisels which aren t as sharp now that I ve been using them. (they re still sharper than my original set though) I had access to a Tormek for a while but no longer but these swiss made ones were sharper than my original set even after using the Tormek. Preferably I d like to only sharpen them a few times a year and just use a hone to keep them sharp like my turning tools that go back to hair shaving scary sharp after 30 seconds with the hone and maybe some MDF or leather.

Suggestions needed please.

- Andybb
Andybb,

While the Swiss Made (Pfeil) chisels come from the factory kinda sharp they are not "working" sharp from the box. Getting to sharp is simple with just three stones. One to grind, one to set up the edge for the polishing stone (take the grind scratches down and establish a wire edge), and a finishing stone to "chase the wire" and polish the remaining scratches. Some folks like to finish with a strop, some don't, either way works. To do this you need to develop the ability to "see" sharp and to "feel" sharp.

Fingers are very sensitive and once trained can feel very minute differences along the edge. A sharp edge will not reflect light. If an edge feels sharp and looks sharp it is sharp and testing is unnecessary, in fact counter productive because it will begin degrading the edge before it ever touches wood in anger. Feel and look are all that is necessary.

Almost any set of grinding and polishing stones/medium will work but somewhat depending on the steel of the cutter being sharpened. A2 and D2 iron can be slow on Natural stones. Where the differences come in, everything is a trade off between speed, cost, mess, and hassle.

Arkansas stones can be a little slow on A2 and D2 but have little hassle or mess and are cheap. Man made water stones can be very quick but that quickness comes with the cost of mess and hassle. When all factors are taken into account the speed difference between Ark and Man Made water stones is negligible. Synthetic water stones' cost is all over the place from very cheap to kinda expensive. The third option when using stones is JNats. JNats fit kinda in between Ark stones and synthetic stones in speed, mess, and hassle. The cost of JNats range from kinda expensive to hold onto your hat.

Diamond stones are ok for grinding but tend to leave scratches that are difficult to remove and are not very good as polishing stones. Sandpaper I can't address because I've never used it.

The best advise I can give is find a system that fits into your needs, stick with it and set up a sharpening station that stays set up and is close to your work area. Then sharpen at the first sign of the cutter being "not sharp as it was".

ken
 
#12 ·
https://www.lumberjocks.com/Bertha/blog/111177
Remembered this blog from a while ago, some good info!

Sharpening is another one of dem rabbit holes that can be confusing and frustrating but after you see the light all will be understood !
Nothing beats watching someone with experience demonstrate a method that works, then with some practice finding out for yourself the method that will work for you.
Nothing funnier than handing someone a sharp chisel with the warning, careful it is sharp then watching the blood flow when they touch it with a finger to see for themselves:)
 
#15 · (Edited by Moderator)
Andy - I m with you on sharpening is worse than sanding.
if I could find a reliable tool sharpener in my area, I would PAY
to have them all brought back to Scary Sharp and "maintain" them
(this time) like they should be.

- John Smith
John,

I can kinda understand if you are one of the folks that put sharpening off until the tool is unusable dull and then puts it in a pile to be sharpened later. When the pile is big and there are many chisels and cutters to sharpen then go at it in a sharpening frenzy. If I worked that way I would hate it as well.

The secret is as posted above: Have a permanent sharpening station set up and ready to go (that means it isn't a storage area) and sharpen at the first sign of dulling. If you do that, keeping all your chisels and cutters sharp only takes a minute or two at a time and it will not be a drudgery. Even better it gives you a short break and time to think about what you are doing…It has saved my bacon more than once.

A photo of my sharpening station:

Shoe Wood Shelving Writing desk Hardwood


Oil stones are on the left side, synthetic and JNat water stones on the right. The station is a couple of steps off the left end of the main workbench. Seldom used stones are kept in the overhead cabinet. No chisel or cutter is put away dull.

ken

P.S. Freehand helps because it is faster but is not necessary. Jigs work this way as well.
.

.
 

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#16 ·
When I sharpen my good p!anes, I use water stones and a MKII guide. It takes time to set up and get sharp.

However, for my chisels and everyday working, I use a Worksharp 3000. I use diamond disks and a hone with green stuff. It works and is quick.

Some people go to quite extensive lengths to sharpen their tools. It takes time and money. This is great for a lot of people.

Others want a quick, easy and relatively cheap method to sharpen. It may not sharpen to the scary sharp level but will work fine for a lot of people.
 
#18 ·
I have two plastic bins that constitute my current sharpening system.

One has dry stuff, like my Veritas guide (the original one I've had for 25 years or so) or oil stones for rough work, etc. It keeps all the loose stuff in one place. It also has my one diamond stone (400/600) that I will use for flattening backs and cutting new, or straightening out, bevels.

Then, I have one that is my 'wet' box. It has a flat piece of solid surface countertop scrap that is about 8×3 and usually several pieces of wet/dry paper cut to size for the plate. I will use 220, 400, 1000, 2000 and 3000 (but only as coarse as I absolutely have to) to hone an edge.

I don't sharpen as often as I should, but I am working on it. But, I will say, the sharper my tools are, the safer and easier to use they are. I like being able to grab a chisel and gently shave a surface until it is practically burnished. Most of my planes will cut a surface better than sandpaper. That keeps me motivated to sharpen. Sadly, my tools are a lot sharper than many of the other professionals I have worked with over the years. So, don't feel alone in your sharpening woes! LOL

I want to get to the point where I am using some of the finer water stones, and maybe replace some of my steps with diamond stones. But, I gotta say, 3k paper puts a nice finish on a blade!

Anyway, the wet/dry paper is inexpensive to get into and it does a good job.
 
#19 · (Edited by Moderator)
A photo of my sharpening station:

Shoe Wood Shelving Writing desk Hardwood


Oil stones are on the left side, synthetic and JNat water stones on the right. The station is a couple of steps off the left end of the main workbench. Seldom used stones are kept in the overhead cabinet. No chisel or cutter is put away dull.
I was on my way to all of this kit and space (a dedicated bench) until I watched Paul Sellers. My water stones are a ton of work and a big mess. Now I've simplified to a 1/2hp low speed Rikon grinder on a stand with wheels, a DMT 1000grit equivalent plate and my 20 year old King 8000grit water stone. It's all I need for chisels, planes and turning tools. One of these months when I have a little extra $$ I'll buy a CBN wheel for the grinder but I'm fine with the stock white wheels. If something is really bad I have a multi-use granite surface plate and 200grit sand paper.
 

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#20 ·
It sounds like many of you have figured out how to sharpen your plane blades and chisels. Now suppose you are a woodcarver and your 40+ gouges are nearly all curved. How useful are your flat stones and granite tiles?
 
#22 · (Edited by Moderator)
I've got Shapton water stones, seldom use them since I bought a WorkSharp 3000. Wonderful little tool. If needed you can grind down a rough blade, but it's best at just taking a second, and keeping them sweet. Literally 3 to 4 seconds, and done. I swear it takes longer for it to spin up to speed, than to refresh an edge.

I cheat and don't buy WS supplies. I can get a LOT of paper for the cost of one of their assortment packs, and their glass discs, which break easily, can be replaced with 1/2" MDF. I use solid 6" AO Aluminum Oxide discs with a PSA backing.

Paper source for average paper. Buy 6' Heavy weight backed paper with a PSA backing.

Place I get super high grit paper, same quality as the WS stuff, but this goes higher grits.

On both of these not having a hole isn't an issue. Find center by placing a new disc on the tool, use your fingers to tell you where the soft center is, and take an awl, and poke a hole. Widening it out for the bolt to get through is just slowly moving it on. Takes maybe 10 seconds total, and your new paper is ready to use. I have MDF plates for all of the grits I use, and find you can mark the faces with a marker, and not affect the grit. I put same grit on both sides, so if the up side is dirty, I can quickly flip it.

I've found using the high grit paper I don't need leather, and rouge. So no messy end, but the WS's do really make some really fine black dust. I wear a 2 strap mask. A couple of chisels requiring some heavier work, and you will coat the machine in fine dust. On chisels I have bought from E Bay, most are a mess, and regrinding to get to where I want them can make a dust storm.
 
#23 ·
Phil I can do shapes on the WS. A turner friend always brings his dull chisels over for a fresh edge. He knows I am a cheap Ho for good beer. Plus I sharpen my carving tools on it a well as flat stuff. Like anyone sharpening shapes there is a little bit of the Chevy Chase na nan na na na na thing.
 
#24 · (Edited by Moderator)
As you know, you've got options. Short term and long run.

(1) I acquired some leather, then cut it into circles and glued them together. A bolt, a couple washers and a nut and I can shove it in the drill press, then charge it with my favorite compound. The stuff used for carving knives is impressive.

(2) I, also, have chunks of granite I can lay wet sandpaper on, then drizzle water over. Granite places have to throw a lot away and you don't need machinist grade accuracy for our purposes.

If need be, you can cut it with an angle grinder and a HF diamond blade, with a drizzle of water.

(3) I use my stationary buffer to bring a polish to blades. It does quick work with inexpensive red jeweler's rouge.

(4) I have a four wheel grinder (pillow blocks and other goodies on a metal frame) It' driven by a 3/4 horse, DC motor. It's reversible and I can run it down to, say, 300 RPM. I have CBN wheels, a diamond wheel and a standard wheel. The slow speed really cuts down on wasting metal.
 
#25 · (Edited by Moderator)
They have pretty good selections of round, triangle and other shapes in stones available on line.

You could, if need be, make profiles out of leather or MDF, then charge that. I haven't done it yet, but it may be a bit of my flocking would make a nice finish to toss the compound on to.

A good compound makes quick work of sharpening both the tips of my palm and other chisels, as well as my impact tips. Flexcut has some GREAT gold buff compound.

I've used toilet ring wax and diatomaceous earth to make my own plastic polish. It works on metal too. I suspect a bit of experimenting with adding fine carbide, in a small quantity, might make for an interesting experiment.

It sounds like many of you have figured out how to sharpen your plane blades and chisels. Now suppose you are a woodcarver and your 40+ gouges are nearly all curved. How useful are your flat stones and granite tiles?

- Phil32
 
#26 ·
I learned the hard way and Bubba has it right. Keep them sharp as you use them. Don't wait until they are giving you poor results. Take a minute away from what you're doing and hit the stones. Also, don't get too hung up on angle. I did that and made things more complicated than it should be. Put a secondary bevel on the tip too and keep that sharp. Much less metal to move. And the old adage of practice makes perfect applies. Once you get the feel, it will be second nature. No guides or gizmos required. Just a few good stones and a flattening stone. That is important especially if you're using wet stones. Takes a few passes on the wet stone to true it up.
 
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