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Old Delta Invicta Planer plus phase converter.

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Forum topic by Floyd Hall posted 07-24-2019 04:35 AM 1127 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Floyd Hall

179 posts in 1000 days


07-24-2019 04:35 AM

Topic tags/keywords: tablesaw planer

Hi all,

Does anyone know anything about an older four-post 13i Delta Invicta Planer, Model 22665. It’s 3-phase and it comes with a converter. I’m particularly interested in whether the converter can be set up to use with a table saw as well, but that may be for another string. The reason I ask is I’m working on an old 12i Darra-James 95 table saw that has a 1-phase 2 hp motor set up for 230v. I already have the service for 220v. I was thinking that I can swap the 2 hp out for a 3 hp 3-phase motor and put the planer and the saw on the same phase converter, that would be great.

Floyd


15 replies so far

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Fred Hargis

6166 posts in 3223 days


#1 posted 07-24-2019 10:35 AM

My lathe has a VFD that was added to it, and I have a 3 phase plug that coneccts it to the lathe. Should I acquire more 3 phase tools, I can switch back and forth by unplugging/pluggin in the two (or more) tools. Not sure about having them hooked up together….I know guys who wired their shop with 3 phase power than was powered by an RPC. Obviously it has to be large enough to handle the load.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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Floyd Hall

179 posts in 1000 days


#2 posted 07-31-2019 12:41 AM

If it helps any, this is very similar to the RC-33 planer, looks identical, except it has a Brazilian made motor (Weg, I think). Are the parts readily available, etc.? I’ve seen some prices and they’re all over the place. This one is fairly cheap, but I don’t want to get into an endless fix.

Floyd

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CaptainKlutz

2987 posts in 2224 days


#3 posted 08-01-2019 07:38 AM

Can’t help with vfd. Get the model information and look up the manual. It’s one of the programmable versions, changing tools could require reprogramming settings.

As far as planer:
The Invicta is clone of the US made Delta RC-33, PN 22-650.

Have seen some differences in various models produced, sort of a type 1 or type 2 situation?
Some older 13” planers have strictly mechanical belt/chain gear box on same side as motor shaft.
Newer versions have a 2 speed oil filled gear box on opposite side of the motor shaft.

Parts for 13” planers are generally hard to find. Finding parts for the older versions without the 2 speed gear box opposite the motor, have become difficult as the old Delta that made those is long gone. The newer version with separate gear box, has some parts in common with 15” 22-680 models made in Taiwan. Even some Grizzly 15” parts will fit them. One issue with Invicta models is lack of manuals and general information due age and place of manufacture. Vintage Machinery site only hosts info for US made 22-650 planers. The Brizilian made Invicta models have become sort of orphan machine(s) today.

If the tool is running and in good shape, they are hard to kill and an asset to any shop. If it has broken/missing parts; then it’s probably not worth the trouble. I skipped bidding for one recently, as it had been left outside and needed an entire rebuild. The bearings are easy to find, but replacing a rusted in-feed roller was not going to be easy or cheap. If it’s running, be sure to check amount of wear/play on the in-feed and out-feed bearing blocks. These are wear items, and planer adjustments will let use worn out bearings until it’s so bad, the cutter head touches the out-feed roller. yes, it’s a major ouch when it happens.

Hope this helps.
Cheers!

Best Luck.

-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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Floyd Hall

179 posts in 1000 days


#4 posted 08-01-2019 08:10 AM


As far as planer:
The Invicta is clone of the US made Delta RC-33, PN 22-650.

Parts for 13” planers are generally hard to find. Finding parts for the older versions without the 2 speed gear box opposite the motor, have become difficult as the old Delta that made those is long gone. The newer version with separate gear box, has some parts in common with 15” 22-680 models made in Taiwan. Even some Grizzly 15” parts will fit them. One issue with Invicta models is lack of manuals and general information due age and place of manufacture. Vintage Machinery site only hosts info for US made 22-650 planers. The Brizilian made Invicta models have become sort of orphan machine(s) today.

If the tool is running and in good shape, they are hard to kill and an asset to any shop. If it has broken/missing parts; then it s probably not worth the trouble . . . but replacing a rusted in-feed roller was not going to be easy or cheap. If it s running, be sure to check amount of wear/play on the in-feed and out-feed bearing blocks. These are wear items, and planer adjustments will let use worn out bearings until it s so bad, the cutter head touches the out-feed roller. yes, it s a major ouch when it happens.

- CaptainKlutz

Thanks, Captain,

It is in working order, but it struggled with a 4i wide piece of red oak. It is only one-speed. The in-feed roller is a little rusty, but not that bad. I was more worried about the out-feed roller and whether the gripping material on it could be replaced. Not sure what the in-feed and out-feed bearing blocks are, but I’ll look into it. Right now, in general, this machine looks like a 50-50 proposition. I could work great in the long term or not at all. Either way, it looks to need extensive clean up.

The good news is I can get it for about $100.

Floyd

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CaptainKlutz

2987 posts in 2224 days


#5 posted 08-01-2019 09:10 AM

Not an expert on 13” models, but have rebuilt a couple 15” planers and owned one 13”?
Issue I find is lack of maintenance. The in/out roller bearings require periodic oiling. Some are easy to inspect, others are covered. If not oiled regularly, the oil-lite bearing material breaks down, and starts to wear the roller shaft. The pressure from top mounted springs often hide the wear. Look for gap on top and sides of bearing block. Once shaft gets a few thousands wear, the rollers move inside new bearings, and are harder to adjust. The result is need for new roller, not just new roller surface.

Can get out-feed roller re-coated if needed. Several places do it. Local is usually cheaper than mail order, but western roller can re-coat 15” planer rollers for ~$125 + shipping

Single speed model won’t have resale value of 2 speed units, but @ $100 with vfd; it seems repairable based on your posts, so you won’t lose money.

I would have offered $80, and brought it home already.
Read OWWM rule #5.

Best Luck.

-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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Floyd Hall

179 posts in 1000 days


#6 posted 08-02-2019 01:03 AM


Can get out-feed roller re-coated if needed. Several places do it. Local is usually cheaper than mail order, but western roller can re-coat 15” planer rollers for ~$125 + shipping

Single speed model won t have resale value of 2 speed units, but @ $100 with vfd; it seems repairable based on your posts, so you won t lose money.

I would have offered $80, and brought it home already.
Read OWWM rule #5.

Best Luck.

- CaptainKlutz

Actually, he wants $350 for both but that’s not what I would offer. I was think $100 for the planer alone and maybe $100 for the RPC. Now I’m thinking maybe I don’t want to deal with the planer at all. Just have too much on my plate. The RPC I might want though. Just not sure what it’s worth.

Floyd

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Floyd Hall

179 posts in 1000 days


#7 posted 08-05-2019 02:21 AM

Made the offer and got turned down. Probably just as well.

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Rickp8713

7 posts in 50 days


#8 posted 04-05-2020 04:28 AM

I have just recently purchase Delta 22665 / RC_33. My issue is that the motor data plate is missing I would like to switch the 3 phase motor out to a 220 single phase
Does anyone know the HP, RPM, FRAME,? All this information is on the motor data plate.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

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MrUnix

7985 posts in 2928 days


#9 posted 04-05-2020 05:05 AM

My issue is that the motor data plate is missing I would like to switch the 3 phase motor out to a 220 single phase.
- Rickp8713

According to the catalog, 1981 was the year when the RC-33 was introduced as a new addition to their machine lineup. It shows them shipped with either a 2hp single phase or 3hp three phase motor. The single phase motor was catalog #62-175. Specs: Ball bearing, capacitor start, capacitor run, 3450 RPM, TEFC, NEMA 145T frame with 10 foot cord, on/off switch mounted in motor junction box and manual re-set thermal overload protection. It also says the pulley shipped with the 2hp motor is 7/8” bore. The size on the 3hp is not specified. Measure yours first so you can get the correct shaft size, otherwise you will be looking for a new pulley as well.

Note:
The 3hp 3 phase machine was catalog #22-655 (not 22-665)
The 2hp single phase machine was catalog #22-651
The machine without any motor was catalog #22-650

If you can find a replacement motor for $200 or less, then go for it… otherwise, it would probably be more cost effective to get a VFD and the extra benefits that come along with it.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

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Rickp8713

7 posts in 50 days


#10 posted 04-05-2020 05:12 AM

Thank you for the awesome information. I’ve been looking for hours.
You obviously a rock star .

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Rickp8713

7 posts in 50 days


#11 posted 04-05-2020 05:36 AM

I was originally going to go with a VFD. But after reading all the reviews I’m so undecided about what is a good one and what to stay away from. Alot of negative reviews on the VFDs. with that said I would much rather go with a VFD. Do you happen to know a good one for my application? Thanks again

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MrUnix

7985 posts in 2928 days


#12 posted 04-05-2020 06:10 AM

I was originally going to go with a VFD. But after reading all the reviews I m so undecided about what is a good one and what to stay away from. Alot of negative reviews on the VFDs. with that said I would much rather go with a VFD. Do you happen to know a good one for my application?
- Rickp8713

The TECO (Westinghouse) VFD’s are probably the most popular and least expensive of the brand name ones. The TECO FM50’s were a solid and inexpensive drive, but they apparently are now being phased out in favor of the newer micro-drives, like the L510-203. It is a very solid and reliable drive, and has a lot of extra features the older FM50 didn’t. The ones most people will say to avoid are the no-name imported ones typically found dirt cheap on e-bay, particularly the ones from unknown sellers.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

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Rickp8713

7 posts in 50 days


#13 posted 04-05-2020 06:32 AM

Thanks. I will try it. Like unsaid inreally wanted to go with the VFD from the beginning. Thanks again

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Rickp8713

7 posts in 50 days


#14 posted 04-06-2020 06:38 PM

I have received a lot of really good information on here about my 22665 / RC-33 Delta planer. I know now the single phase motors frame is a 145T. Does anyone know what the FRAME is for the 3 phase motor? They bolt on differently. The single phase bolts onto a bracket from the bottom and the 3 phase bolts on from the face. So the FRAME must be different. Or maybe we’re I might find this information. Any information would be greatly appreciate. Thanks

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MrUnix

7985 posts in 2928 days


#15 posted 04-06-2020 07:23 PM

I believe the later model planers used the c-frame mounting for both single and three phase. The frame is 145TCZ-85. This was from a 62-185 2hp motor, which was listed as the motor for the 22-665 planer on ereplacements website.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

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