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New house, new shop, need some ideas

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Forum topic by sansoo22 posted 06-16-2019 11:32 PM 716 views 1 time favorited 43 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


06-16-2019 11:32 PM

Been house shopping for a couple months and finally found something to make an offer on. One owner 1965 ranch home that is a bit dated but so well maintained i was a bit awe struck by the previous owner’s meticulous nature. Anyway pending any disasters in the inspection we close in 3 weeks. Figured it would be a good time to seek help on dust collection and any other general things you fellow wood workers would have done different when moving into your first big shop space. I know im jumping the gun a bit but im buying soon even if its not this one so may as well start planning now.

Quick bit of details, the owners moved the washer and dryer into the garage when they got older. They did a pretty sweet built in for them and even included a 1/2 bath. That space is getting converted to a giant plane till/hand tool closet. The overall dimensions of the space are 20×24 and about 2.5 times larger than i have now.

The house only has 60 amp service but we already checked with electric company and 200 amp is no biggie. The washer dryer and electrical get done as soon as i sell a rental property and the coffers are refilled. I plan to install a 100 amp sub panel in the garage.

Right now i dont have any tools requiring 220. I plan to pick those up used or as needed for home remodel projects. What I would like advice on is how to lay out circuits for table saw, dust collector, jointer and planer. I’m thinking of setting up a dust collector first thing after electric is upgraded. My contractor table saw, band saw, and compound sliding miter all have 2-1/2” ports on them. I know reducing a 4” or 6” duct will reduce my DC efficiency but it has to still be better than a cyclone shop vac setup i have now.

Would doing DC first be a good place to start and upgrade table saw next? Do i need a dedicated circuit for every large tool or could I (code allowing) do a fused junction box for a jointer and planer? Can’t imagine I’d ever run either of those at the same time.

Sorry long winded post but as a software architect I kind of need a plan for everything. Its just how i work.


43 replies so far

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ibewjon

684 posts in 3215 days


#1 posted 06-17-2019 12:29 AM

Every tool gets a breaker in my shop. 2 HP jet DC with pleated filter and 5” ductwork, 26 guage steel, works great. I ran it low, about 3’ above floor, easy to reach gates and no ducts blocking lighting from ceiling. 2 lighting circuts with NO receptacles or tools on those circuts.

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BlasterStumps

1328 posts in 861 days


#2 posted 06-17-2019 12:30 AM

I would suggest looking into Square D panels. Unless things have changed since I bought ours, they have really fast trip curves.

The power supplier has to provide adequate service to the meter based on your calculated load. Your costs will come when you put in a bigger panel, breakers, wiring etc. I would get estimates from Electrical contractors on the upgrade.

-- "I build for function first, looks second. Most times I never get around to looks." - Mike, western Colorado

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ibewjon

684 posts in 3215 days


#3 posted 06-17-2019 12:47 AM

Square D is the best. Period. And it is not overpriced. I have changed out alot of other brands of panels over the last 40 years, the replacements were always Square D.

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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


#4 posted 06-17-2019 01:13 AM

If Square D is the best then I will go with that. I’m kind of a perfectionist with home improvements. Especially those involving electrical, plumbing, HVAC or roofing. I refuse to do less than the best just to save some cash. Buy once cry once on those.

I was looking at a Grizzly 2HP with pleated filter. The G0548ZP i believe was the model number. Its not a dual stage with a cyclone but i think i could source or build a cyclone cheaper than the Grizzly models that have one. I’m open to other models tho. I have a Woodcraft in my city and a Grizzly showroom a couple hour drive away so freight isnt a big deal.

Dedicated breaker for every tool is definitely do able. Last time i checked code in my area I’m allowed to pull all the runs and wire up any outlets and lights that I want. I do need a contractor to install the panel and hook everything up to it. I will be scheduling an estimate on that once i close on the house

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ibewjon

684 posts in 3215 days


#5 posted 06-17-2019 02:01 AM

Square D QO type breakers, not Square D Homline. The reason for nothing on the lighting circuts is safety…if anything trips you won’t lose lights and be stumbling around in the dark. Which grizzly store are you near? That would be handy. I made my own Y’s using a spot welder from Harbor Freight, and 26 guage snap Lok duct. Paid for the welder and then some. Use long radius 90’s from Oneida or any other supplier. I don’t have a cyclone, and I vent back into the shop due to heating and cooling.

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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


#6 posted 06-17-2019 03:50 PM



Square D QO type breakers, not Square D Homline. The reason for nothing on the lighting circuts is safety…if anything trips you won t lose lights and be stumbling around in the dark. Which grizzly store are you near? That would be handy. I made my own Y s using a spot welder from Harbor Freight, and 26 guage snap Lok duct. Paid for the welder and then some. Use long radius 90 s from Oneida or any other supplier. I don t have a cyclone, and I vent back into the shop due to heating and cooling.

- ibewjon

Took a look at the differences between Square D QO and Homeline. Definitely going with the QO series. I may put in an Eaton surge protector as well. I don’t have any experience with them but I have a lot of electronics…i mean a lot. Like 3 servers and a house full of automation equipment.

I like the idea of the lights on a separate circuit. Could an air cleaner be put on this same circuit? Even the big one grizzly sells is only a 3A load. For the safety reasons you mentioned I was thinking 2 circuits for the lights. An outer ring of lights on one and another for a couple big LEDs in the center of the space. Those big LEDs would be on their very own “safety” circuit since they will be over top the table saw which in my view is the most dangerous tool in the shop. I would put the air cleaner in with the outer ring of lights.

I’m close to the Grizzly showroom in Springfield MO. I think its 3 hrs and 4 min according to Google to get there. For all my duct work I’m going to try and bribe my cousin who is an HVAC installer to come up for a weekend. He has 5 teenage daughters so I’m sure he won’t mind the 2hr drive to escape that for a weekend.

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ibewjon

684 posts in 3215 days


#7 posted 06-17-2019 04:29 PM

Square D makes a good wire in arrestor, also a snap in surge breaker that fits QO panels. Home Depot carries both. Put one in the house and the shop.. whether you are in K, O, A, or M, I know how much lightning you get there. I have spent alot of time there.

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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


#8 posted 06-17-2019 04:58 PM

Ya Kansas City gets all of the weather. From blizzards to days with 80%+ humidity in the summer. This year mother nature has been putting on quite a show. We had lightning, thunder, snow, and ice all in a 2 day stretch this winter. This spring we had the first tornado hit city limits in something like 26 yrs. We are currently at 300% rain fall i think. The lightning displays this spring have been some of the scariest and most awesome I have ever seen. Its kind of hard to explain if you haven’t seen it. Like staring directly into 36 old school camera flashes at the same time. And then wondering if any pictures fell off the wall when the thunder hits. And its not uncommon to have a late summer early fall drought with temps above 100 and dry lightning.

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OleGrump

322 posts in 766 days


#9 posted 06-17-2019 04:59 PM

Probably a good many of us are jealous of a pre existing half bath right in the shop. The old lady can’t be bitching about you tracking sawdust inside whenever nature calls, which is a huge plus not having to hear her mouth. If it were me, as finances allowed, I would take part of the former washer/dryer space and add a shower stall. (see preceding comment, which also applies to lawn mower clippings and the like) Then you can be “all nice and clean” when you go back inside the main house. The other modification to consider would be to add a deep sink in the half bath. (NOT a laundry tub) My brother did this in his half bath with a nice stainless steel model. I think his was intended for kitchen use, but comes in mighty handy for rinsing brushes and that kind of thing. Just some food for thought.

-- OleGrump

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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


#10 posted 06-17-2019 05:08 PM

OleGrump – I hadn’t even thought about a shower. I will have to take a look at how they laid out the plumbing to see if i can fit one. They used paneling for the washer dryer space and 1/2 bath so opening up a wall to take a peak won’t be too hard. I was already planning a urinal, stainless deep sink, and onyx walls for that 1/2 bath. Something i could hose down if the “cleaning committee” came out and griped at me.

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ibewjon

684 posts in 3215 days


#11 posted 06-17-2019 06:06 PM

I was in KC for a week in May. And my family is from Frontenac, a bit south.

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HackFabrication

140 posts in 133 days


#12 posted 06-18-2019 10:17 AM

You’re going to want at least one 220v circuit in your garage, or a couple. Wire all the other circuits with 12g and 20a breakers. The more circuits, the better, so when you’re looking at different sub panels, plan on future expansion.

You didn’t mention an air compressor, but you’ll eventually need/want one. Especially if your shop will see multi-duty as a auto/metal work area.

A good plan of attack, is to draw up a layout of where things are going to sit. A table saw (contractor or cabinet) takes up a lot of floor space. More so if you have any sort of outfeed table on it. My woodshop area is in my basement, so everything needs to be mobile. I have 1/2 of a 2.5 car garage for the auto/metal shop area.

When I had my electrical service upgraded (a good 15+ years back), I had two 220v circuits installed in my garage sub panel. One for my 7.5hp air compressor, and another for a future welder.

Since you’re in NY, you also want to consider heating options for the shop.

I regret not having more wall outlets. Even though I now have two double outlets (8 outlets) on each wall, it would be nice not to need an extension cord (or unplug/re-plug) my shop vac to reach the entire space.

Oh, and while you’re at it, I’d also consider installing an outside outlet (or two) by the garage door.

-- "In the end, it's all Hack..."

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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


#13 posted 06-18-2019 03:51 PM

I actually have 2 air compressors but nothing super fancy. Just a small 6 gallon pancake and my big craftsman pro 30 gallon. The craftsman says its a 15A load but i dont believe it. The power cord is as big as my thumb and its tripped a 20A if it kicked on when i was running a shop vac on the same outlet. I don’t do much in the way of auto work anymore. In fact my 1976 C10 SWB is supposed to be find a new home today.

I’m just now getting back into welding a bit. My boss gave me a full Purox oxy torch set including lines, gauges, and a bunch of brand new tips. My main purpose for those once I get a couple tanks is making my own mobile bases for big tools that dont have one.

I live in Kansas City so planning an exhaust fan as well as heating and cooling for the garage. The owner of my gym has a brand new “hotel” unit he never installed in his garage so I might be able to pick that up on the cheap.

Good idea installing a few outlets by the garage door that are normally free of regular use. On the topic of outlets is there any reason I can’t install the garage outlets like 4 ft off the ground? My brothers garage has them near normal house height and i find it highly annoying.

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ibewjon

684 posts in 3215 days


#14 posted 06-18-2019 04:31 PM

No reason at all. That is considered above cabinet height. Mine are all 48” to bottom, same height as switches. Unless prohibited by local code. I only have a 16×22 shop, but I have 10 receptacles for 240v and double 120v receptacles every 32”. I also put in switches for under cabinet strip lights since my tools are along the wall and ceiling lights are behind and above me. Good lighting is important as we age. The DC duct is a little below the receptacles running along the wall. This puts the blast gates at an easy to reach height. Back to receptacles, all 120v in a garage or workshop must be GFCI protected. Even if you don’t have an inspection, use the GFCI receptacles for your own safety. I also put a couple timer controlled receptacles for battery chargers.

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sansoo22

151 posts in 76 days


#15 posted 06-19-2019 09:47 PM

Did the inspection today. Should have grabbed some pics of the garage space but so many people chattering away at me all at once and i forgot. Sellers found an issue with the garage half bath on their own and are spending $5300 to have it fixed. They sent me the estimate for the work they are having done. They are also having all of the main drains cleaned and scoped on their dime. I’m still getting my own inspection just because i have a severe lack of trust in all human life forms. But so far so good.

Garage is going to need a lot of work but i’m excited for the 9ft ceilings. Its all paneling right now that needs to go but will have to wait until washer and dryer are relocated. I will probably re-sheet the whole garage with OSB and put my new GCFI outlets at the top of the first run of sheeting. Should make cutting them all in much easier.

Other than the plumbing issue and lack of attic insulation the inspector was quite pleased. And the structural engineer was almost giddy about the overkill used to fix the foundation. Im not a fan of having a house with repaired foundation but it seems many in Kansas City have shifted and cracked at some point. Unless it was carved into the Missouri bedrock it most likely moved.

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