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WorkSharp 3000 vs Diamond Stones vs Sandpaper/Veritas Mk II

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Forum topic by Holbs posted 02-25-2019 05:24 AM 666 views 0 times favorited 22 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Holbs

2243 posts in 2538 days


02-25-2019 05:24 AM

Topic tags/keywords: worksharp 3000 diamond stones eze-lap

I tried something out today. I have the Worksharp 3000, Eze-Lap diamond stones, precision granite block with sandpaper and the Veritas MK II.
With my 8” power jointer out of temporary action, figured I best rehab a Stanley #7 that needed some loving and have a go at my Roubo bench project with hand tools.
So I take the Stanley #7 iron which measures around 2 1/4” wide or so and head over to the Worksharp to flatten the back. About 20-30min later upon 120 grit, I have the scratch marks along the front edge about 3/8” or 1/2” range.
However, I’ve always been concerned about the wheel vibration and undulation due to rotation and applying pressure to one side of the glass/sandpaper wheel. Wanted to see if the back was truly flat.
I pull out my 150 grit Eze-Lap diamond stone, Veritas Mk II and black sharpie, and goto work. After 15-20 strokes I take a peek. Ugly. According to my diamond stones, the back is not flat at all. Scratch makes well beyond 1/2” from the front edge.
A second opinion is needed in case my diamond stones are not truly flat. Out comes my precision granite block and 120 grit sandpaper. Yep, same results. I go back to the diamond stones to flatten the back. I now come to realize that is not the strength of diamond stones; removal of lots of iron such as flattening backside of a large plane iron. Swapped back to sandpaper with much faster results (as in… 50-60% faster results). Though still took a good 2 hours to get a perfect flat back.
So… either I am doing something wrong with the worksharp (do not see how… it’s a flat glass plate with sandpaper in rotation while holding the plane iron pointing towards center knob and I hold the iron in place for 10-15 seconds and then cool it) or due to the vibration and undulation, the Worksharp does not truly give a flat expectation.
Anyone else with this experience on the Worksharp or diamond stones not effective upon large surface areas? I do wonder if diamond stones…give out (I thought they were lifetime).

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"


22 replies so far

View gmc's profile

gmc

64 posts in 2665 days


#1 posted 02-25-2019 11:59 AM

You should not have any vibration on the ws3000 disc. I have used it for many years and I never have a problem getting flat backs on my irons. You can make the disc out of mdf and use compound if you think you have a problem with the glass one. Once you get your irons flat you can get your edges sharp in minutes with the worksharp. Best investment I have made. Stumpy nubs has a plan for the ws3000 that makes it useful for wider irons and shows you how to use mdf for the disc. Highly recommend for anyone with one. No more expensive sandpaper or disc. Good luck I hope you get it figured out.

-- Gary, Central Illinois

View fivecodys's profile

fivecodys

1487 posts in 2145 days


#2 posted 02-25-2019 05:13 PM

I was not having much luck with the wider irons on my WS300 but I was able to find the Wide Blade Attachment kit and that really made a huge difference.
I have a short review here: https://www.lumberjocks.com/reviews/11633

If you are experiencing “wheel vibration and undulation” then there is definitely something wrong with your set up. Remove the disk and make sure that there is not any buildup of metal dust around the hub where the disk rests. It should run very smooth…no wobbles.
Is the machine vibrating excessively without a disk mounted to it? If so then you have a bad machine.
If its nice and smooth then you will have to look at the glass disk itself.
I have 4 glass disks and all seem to run nice and smooth.

I also have Stumpy Nubs plans but since adding the Wide Blade Attachment I have not felt the need to build them. I have thought about adding a couple of MDF disks to use with compounds instead of sandpaper.

Please let us know what happens. Good luck!

-- When you leave your shop for the night, make sure you can always count to 10.

View avsmusic1's profile

avsmusic1

528 posts in 1194 days


#3 posted 02-25-2019 09:08 PM

unfortunately the wide blade attachment is no longer made
I was looking hard at the WS300 but it’s not worth it for me if I can’t do blades over 2” wide

View fivecodys's profile

fivecodys

1487 posts in 2145 days


#4 posted 02-25-2019 09:56 PM



unfortunately the wide blade attachment is no longer made
I was looking hard at the WS300 but it s not worth it for me if I can t do blades over 2” wide

- avsmusic1


I was lucky to get mine I guess. This is what I was going to do and would still do if I couldn’t find that attachment.

Stumpy Nubs has this plan on his website. http://www.stumpynubs.com/worksharp-3000.html
When I did my search for it I found that several people have made it.

Just an idea.

-- When you leave your shop for the night, make sure you can always count to 10.

View HokieKen's profile

HokieKen

10917 posts in 1647 days


#5 posted 02-25-2019 10:00 PM



unfortunately the wide blade attachment is no longer made
I was looking hard at the WS300 but it s not worth it for me if I can t do blades over 2” wide

- avsmusic1

Look at the Stumpy Nubs WS station. He essentially builds the wide blade table into the stand.

I agree with fivecodys and gmc. I have no such issues with my WS3000.

I wonder if the issue isn’t that you’re “holding the plane iron pointed toward the center knob”. When I flatten chisel or plane iron backs, I gently lay it onto the spinning disc and let it point in the direction that it naturally points which will be the direction of rotation. If you’re pointed toward the center, the abrasive may be catching the edge of the iron and the iron itself may be introducing some chatter/vibration.

-- Kenny, SW VA, Go Hokies!!!

View corelz125's profile

corelz125

850 posts in 1485 days


#6 posted 02-26-2019 12:44 AM

Contact Darex. Explain to them the problem your having. I thought I had a wobble in mine and I sent it back to them they checked the calibration and sent it back to me. I think I only had to pay shipping going to them but that was the only cost.

View Holbs's profile

Holbs

2243 posts in 2538 days


#7 posted 02-26-2019 01:26 AM

I would say… there is no excessive wobble or vibration. It runs smooth without touching the disk. I am just trying to come up with an idea as to why the Worksharp has the looked for scratches from the edge to 1/4-3/8” range. But then, when I take same plane iron over to diamond stones or granite backed sandpaper with the Veritas Mk II, it shows a different story.
I go take a vid really quick. I have a spare plane iron blade I will test with sharpie. And then test with diamond stones.

unfortunately the wide blade attachment is no longer made
I was looking hard at the WS300 but it s not worth it for me if I can t do blades over 2” wide

- avsmusic1

I was lucky to get mine I guess. This is what I was going to do and would still do if I couldn t find that attachment.

Stumpy Nubs has this plan on his website. http://www.stumpynubs.com/worksharp-3000.html
When I did my search for it I found that several people have made it.

Just an idea.

- fivecodys

I’ve been searching high and low for this attachment. Thought I found it in India which turned out to be nothing. There is some in stock at http://www.langevinforest.com/en/work-sharp-wide-blade-attachment-accessory-for-ws300 and https://www.proautomotiveparts.com/pz/work-sharp-3000-wide-blade-attachment . waiting to hear back from them via email.

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

View KelleyCrafts's profile

KelleyCrafts

3929 posts in 1248 days


#8 posted 02-26-2019 02:25 AM

I think the real question here is if you’re working on a Roubo build, why isn’t it in this thread as you build it?

FYI, I have the Veritas jig and stones and WS3000 and since the WS has made it to the shop I haven’t used the others.

-- Dave - http://kelleycrafts.com/ - pen blanks - knife scales - turning tools

View Holbs's profile

Holbs

2243 posts in 2538 days


#9 posted 02-26-2019 02:40 AM



I think the real question here is if you’re working on a Roubo build, why isn’t it in this thread as you build it?

FYI, I have the Veritas jig and stones and WS3000 and since the WS has made it to the shop I haven’t used the others.

- KelleyCrafts

I will post in that thread after I complete the bench.

I do wonder. Folks who have used the WS3000 (which I do love, btw)... have anyone tested/compared chisel/plane flat backs as in going over to diamond stones or sandpaper? I flattened a group of my chisels and some plane irons already with the WS3000. It was only a curiosity that made me wonder a comparison between diamond stones/sandpaper.

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

View gtrgeo's profile

gtrgeo

53 posts in 939 days


#10 posted 02-26-2019 03:00 AM

I have the WS3000 and seem to get great results on chisels and block plane blades. Anything 2” and wider I have struggled. Basically anything that doesn’t fit into the port. I did buy the wide blade attachment and have had mixed results. Like you I struggled with flattening the backs on wider blades. Another issue I noted was with the included honing guide. It does not automatically square the blade when you tighten it. I found the blade lifting on one side. It takes a little patience and close attention to get it square. The table itself takes some patience to get lined up as well. It seems it is never perfect especially when changing grits. I ended up just calling it good and it seemed to work out ok.

Are you guys going in to the wheel from the open side or off of the table when using the wide blade setup?

George

View Holbs's profile

Holbs

2243 posts in 2538 days


#11 posted 02-26-2019 03:16 AM



I have the WS3000 and seem to get great results on chisels and block plane blades. Anything 2” and wider I have struggled. Basically anything that doesn t fit into the port. I did buy the wide blade attachment and have had mixed results. Like you I struggled with flattening the backs on wider blades. Another issue I noted was with the included honing guide. It does not automatically square the blade when you tighten it. I found the blade lifting on one side. It takes a little patience and close attention to get it square. The table itself takes some patience to get lined up as well. It seems it is never perfect especially when changing grits. I ended up just calling it good and it seemed to work out ok.

Are you guys going in to the wheel from the open side or off of the table when using the wide blade setup?

George

- gtrgeo


define…struggled with large plane irons?

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

View HokieKen's profile

HokieKen

10917 posts in 1647 days


#12 posted 02-26-2019 03:20 AM

I sort of did a blog post doing a comparison falttening identical chisels – one on diamonds and the other on the WS3000. However, I never mixed the two methods so it’s not exactly the same thing. I do have a relatively new set of chisels that I did flatten the backs on the WS and I know for sure they’ve never touched my diamonds. So, tomorrow, I’ll try a couple of them on the diamonds and see if there’s any discrepancies…

-- Kenny, SW VA, Go Hokies!!!

View Holbs's profile

Holbs

2243 posts in 2538 days


#13 posted 02-26-2019 03:23 AM



I sort of did a blog post doing a comparison falttening identical chisels – one on diamonds and the other on the WS3000. However, I never mixed the two methods so it’s not exactly the same thing. I do have a relatively new set of chisels that I did flatten the backs on the WS and I know for sure they’ve never touched my diamonds. So, tomorrow, I’ll try a couple of them on the diamonds and see if there’s any discrepancies…

- HokieKen


Will be curious of your results. I really hope it was some user error on my end as to the drastic difference with my results. I really want to make this WS3000 work.
Mind you…I was free-handing flattening the back of the iron starting with 120 grit. Brand new 120 grit. Standing infront of the machine with the blade pointing towards the center. Sliding it closer and away figuring alternate locations would be ideal. Heat sinking every time iron became warm.

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

View gtrgeo's profile

gtrgeo

53 posts in 939 days


#14 posted 02-26-2019 03:24 AM

Holbs – It just feels a bit awkward to me trying to lay the wider plane blades on to the spinning surface while trying to keep it flat for an even grind. My result do not seem as consistent on wide blades as I can acheive on the chisels and block plane blades. Just seems like a lot of surface area to try to keep flat on the spinning surface.

I do agree with the above post regarding letting the blade go to the direction it wants. Fighting the spin of the wheel is not productive and will result in an uneven grind.

View Holbs's profile

Holbs

2243 posts in 2538 days


#15 posted 02-26-2019 03:29 AM


Holbs – It just feels a bit awkward to me trying to lay the wider plane blades on to the spinning surface while trying to keep it flat for an even grind. My result do not seem as consistent on wide blades as I can acheive on the chisels and block plane blades. Just seems like a lot of surface area to try to keep flat on the spinning surface.

I do agree with the above post regarding letting the blade go to the direction it wants. Fighting the spin of the wheel is not productive and will result in an uneven grind. So that was my method of free handing the iron while pointing towards center.

- gtrgeo


Ah…so maybe it is my own user error? When I first used the WS3000, I learned really quick about holding things perpendicular to my body (basically…left or right edge facing) as would result in skewed chisel because of the wheel diameter cutting more as you go further from center.
And watching Stumpy with his WS3000 hint video. He using the wide blade attachment and guide, coming in front the left towards center.
Are you saying you skew your iron on purpose?

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

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