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using 2 router edge guides with 2 rods for mortise or hog out. O1 steel question

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Forum topic by Holbs posted 02-19-2019 10:04 PM 1418 views 0 times favorited 11 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Holbs

2213 posts in 2415 days


02-19-2019 10:04 PM

Topic tags/keywords: o1 steel water oil edge guide

While digging into Roubo workbench construction I am pursuing, I came across a video of someone using a Festool router with 2 edge guides for the 5” beefy legs and chop, one edge guide on each end. What a fantastic idea! Should solve any racking that comes with using a single edge guide, or so I strongly hope. As this would apply to other projects of routing when a straight edge or clamping guide is not possible.
I’ve been looking to 24”, 36”, and 48” rods and run across different material as less flexing under yield would be desired. So far, read some info in regards to hot rolled, cold rolled, water quenched, and oil quenched. I guess there is a science to this stuff :)
To the metal workers here… would oil hard drill rod 01 steel be more ideal for 3/8” router edge guide rod workings than the water hard drill rod 01 steel? Maybe, O1 steel is not ideal at all for this application. I believe the standard steel rods via BORG flex too much due to being hot rolled.
I had to purchase the newer Bosch edge guide as it comes with dust collection port (guess I have older model with no dust port). So…since I’ll have two edge guides, I’d like to give this a shot. Something akin to this:

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"


11 replies so far

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SMP

1017 posts in 291 days


#1 posted 02-20-2019 05:16 AM

I’m still a little confused on what you are routing, and if the legs are only 5” why you would need 24” or longer rod. You’d only need 5” plus the width of 2 guides and a little slack, in which case hot rolled is probably fine. Then again personally I would save the money and just make a jig that would ride the legs out of scrap plywood and other wood pieces i have in the garage.

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Holbs

2213 posts in 2415 days


#2 posted 02-20-2019 05:25 AM

You very well could be right. A couple times in the past when routing a mortise or hogging things out, using a single edge guide did at times “flex” the router ha hair itself because of the single lateral pressure force from it.
There is no money involved as I want the upgrade Bosch edge guard since it comes with dust collection port. I’ll probably get BORG 3/8” rods to test. Knowing me, most of my ideas fail anyways :)

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

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SMP

1017 posts in 291 days


#3 posted 02-20-2019 08:09 AM

Ah ok that makes more sense. I think what you are doing should work and be pretty versatile then. I know what you mean about that “torque steer” thing it does. Thats probably why now I am more apt to make a template out of wood and then use guide bits/bushings.

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EarlS

2784 posts in 2734 days


#4 posted 02-20-2019 12:34 PM

Have you looked into making the jig using multi-track? Woodhaven used to make one that was really solid. I have one somewhere. If I can find it I will set it up and take a couple pictures.

-- Earl "I'm a pessamist - generally that increases the chance that things will turn out better than expected"

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HokieKen

9481 posts in 1524 days


#5 posted 02-20-2019 03:18 PM

I think any high carbon steel will work fine at 3/8”. The stuff at the big box stores is all mild steel. O1 would be a good choice. I’ve never heard of water-hardening O1 (the O actually stands for Oil-hardened) so I can’t speak to that. When you buy drill rod, it will be in the annealed state. And I think that will be just fine for what your are doing. 1095 or 5160 steels are also good options that are commonly available in rod form.

-- Kenny, SW VA, Go Hokies!!!

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Holbs

2213 posts in 2415 days


#6 posted 02-20-2019 04:22 PM


Have you looked into making the jig using multi-track? Woodhaven used to make one that was really solid. I have one somewhere. If I can find it I will set it up and take a couple pictures.

- EarlS


I googled the Woodhaven rail kit. Though looks like it’s more robust and certainly meets the stabilization aspect I am looking for. However at $179, setup time… it’s probably more than what I’m looking for :)


I think any high carbon steel will work fine at 3/8”. The stuff at the big box stores is all mild steel. O1 would be a good choice. I ve never heard of water-hardening O1 (the O actually stands for Oil-hardened) so I can t speak to that. When you buy drill rod, it will be in the annealed state. And I think that will be just fine for what your are doing. 1095 or 5160 steels are also good options that are commonly available in rod form.

- HokieKen

I believe you are correct. I remember the chart I was looking at had W1’s and O1’s. water & oil quenching.
I bought 2×48” mild steel 3/8” rods at HD last night. Waiting for my 2nd Bosch edge guide to arrive and will do some test runs. But I believe these 2 rods I have will suffice as they would act as a brace with the router in between, negating the single lateral pressure causing the router to tilt/flex that 1/16” too far that always seems to happen.

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

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pintodeluxe

5934 posts in 3199 days


#7 posted 02-20-2019 04:34 PM

I would just use the rods that came with your edge guides. Insert half way and tighten the knobs. I’ve never noticed any flex with my Dewalt edge guide, and I only use one. With two edge guides you’ll have twice the support.

I once tried a double edge guide setup – one commercial edge guide, and one shop made edge guide. I made it from aluminum rod and MDF. It worked fine.

-- Willie, Washington "If You Choose Not To Decide, You Still Have Made a Choice" - Rush

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Holbs

2213 posts in 2415 days


#8 posted 02-20-2019 04:37 PM


I would just use the rods that came with your edge guides. Insert half way and tighten the knobs. I ve never noticed any flex with my Dewalt edge guide, and I only use one. With two edge guides you ll have twice the support.

- pintodeluxe


Initially thought that would work. But let’s take for example hogging out the underside of a workbench table top for tail vise. The width distance would be around 12” (as in my case for split top Roubo). With the Bosch edge guides, the clamping mechanisms are 4-5” behind the edge guides. So now talking over 20”. The rods that come with the Bosch edge guides are …. um… er… 12” or so? Too short for this one instance.

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

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SMP

1017 posts in 291 days


#9 posted 02-20-2019 04:42 PM



I believe you are correct. I remember the chart I was looking at had W1 s and O1 s. water & oil quenching.
I bought 2×48” mild steel 3/8” rods at HD last night. Waiting for my 2nd Bosch edge guide to arrive and will do some test runs. But I believe these 2 rods I have will suffice as they would act as a brace with the router in between, negating the single lateral pressure causing the router to tilt/flex that 1/16” too far that always seems to happen.

- Holbs

Another thing that I have done is use clamps to increase rigidity. For example, I have this drill guide https://www.amazon.com/wolfcraft-4525404-Muilt-Angle-Attachment-Drills/dp/B000JCIMEA/ref=sr_1_6?ie=UTF8&qid=1550680516&sr=8-6&keywords=drill+guide
Now imagine in the holes at the bottom of base there are 2 parallel strips of 2×2 wood about a foot long screwed in, spaced to straddle a staircase handrail. However, when the drill starts, the torque twists this thing a bit. So from the side, I put a clamp across so 1 foot of the clamp rests on one strip and the other foot on the other strip. I then apply just enough pressure to keep this thing from twisting at all, but still allows it to slide. Hopefully that helps, if not I can take a picture. So if the mild steel does have any flex, any clamp would probably fix it very easily.

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Holbs

2213 posts in 2415 days


#10 posted 02-20-2019 05:08 PM

Ah. Which reminds me. I really am bad at staying perpendicular 90 degree when drilling. I will get this drill guide

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

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EarlS

2784 posts in 2734 days


#11 posted 02-20-2019 05:50 PM

You might be able to get the track for a decent price and make your own for a lot less than the $179. Plus then you could adapt it to use as a planing sled.

-- Earl "I'm a pessamist - generally that increases the chance that things will turn out better than expected"

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