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Forum topic by EdsCustomWoodCrafts posted 09-15-2018 05:38 AM 666 views 0 times favorited 16 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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EdsCustomWoodCrafts

928 posts in 1762 days


09-15-2018 05:38 AM

Topic tags/keywords: plane

I have been on a restoration tear as this is the second plane that I am trying to restore after successfully restoring a #4 Bailey

This next one is a number #5 but as of yet I can’t determine the brand but my problem is:

I am soaking the plane in a vinegar bath and while I was checking it’s progress I scrubbed away some rust and found what I thought was a build up of rust but it isn’t rust , it’s a crack near the mouth of where the blade protrudes to the underside of the plane and it looks like someone previously welded it .. my question is should I abandon this restoration or should I continue with it.. in the picture above the crack is in the right side and it’s completely through the metal

-- Thanks Ed “A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working. ~Author unknown” . Come check out my website for more about what I make and how at www.edscustomwoodcrafts.com


16 replies so far

View Don W's profile

Don W

19251 posts in 2987 days


#1 posted 09-15-2018 01:03 PM

That’s a braze not a weld, and if the sole is reasonable flat it will work just fine.

If you’re turning it as a jack (with a cambered blade) the sole doesn’t need to be flat anyhow. If it’s meant to be another smoother, it’s more important.

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

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EdsCustomWoodCrafts

928 posts in 1762 days


#2 posted 09-15-2018 01:28 PM



That s a braze not a weld, and if the sole is reasonable flat it will work just fine.

If you re turning it as a jack (with a cambered blade) the sole doesn t need to be flat anyhow. If it s meant to be another smoother, it s more important.

- Don W

Good to know !!! I really want to file down the braze would that weaken the integrity of the joint?

-- Thanks Ed “A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working. ~Author unknown” . Come check out my website for more about what I make and how at www.edscustomwoodcrafts.com

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OSU55

2359 posts in 2409 days


#3 posted 09-15-2018 01:43 PM


Good to know !!! I really want to file down the braze would that weaken the integrity of the joint?

- EdsCustomWoodCrafts


Not could but will weaken the joint. Thing is you probably were thinking of making the surface flat, which the brass thickness above the surface is what holds it together, so then it would fail. Just polish the brass if you must otherwise leave it alone. It may fail anyway – no way to know. Just get it usable and put it to work, if it holds up then do more restoration.

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shampeon

1900 posts in 2603 days


#4 posted 09-15-2018 05:09 PM

My 2 cents: No. 5 jack planes/bodies are plentiful and inexpensive. Use this one as a scrub plane as the always on-point Don suggests, and find a different plane to work on polishing up.

I bought a crappy Buck Brothers jack at Home Depot before I knew anything, and it’s now my scrub plane, where it’s perfectly capable.

-- ian | "You can't stop what's coming. It ain't all waiting on you. That's vanity."

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bandit571

23185 posts in 3103 days


#5 posted 09-15-2018 07:18 PM

nhplaneparts sell plane bottom castings….the trick is to get one that matches (without the crack) the one you have.

Might go and see what Eric has?

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

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corelz125

752 posts in 1396 days


#6 posted 09-15-2018 11:45 PM

which side do you want to file down the outside or the inside? The inside you can grind down some of those boogers

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EdsCustomWoodCrafts

928 posts in 1762 days


#7 posted 09-16-2018 02:18 AM



which side do you want to file down the outside or the inside? The inside you can grind down some of those boogers

- corelz125

The outside unfortunately!!!!

-- Thanks Ed “A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working. ~Author unknown” . Come check out my website for more about what I make and how at www.edscustomwoodcrafts.com

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EdsCustomWoodCrafts

928 posts in 1762 days


#8 posted 09-16-2018 02:19 AM



My 2 cents: No. 5 jack planes/bodies are plentiful and inexpensive. Use this one as a scrub plane as the always on-point Don suggests, and find a different plane to work on polishing up.

I bought a crappy Buck Brothers jack at Home Depot before I knew anything, and it s now my scrub plane, where it s perfectly capable.

- shampeon


That’s worth considering, Thanks

-- Thanks Ed “A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working. ~Author unknown” . Come check out my website for more about what I make and how at www.edscustomwoodcrafts.com

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EdsCustomWoodCrafts

928 posts in 1762 days


#9 posted 09-16-2018 02:21 AM


Good to know !!! I really want to file down the braze would that weaken the integrity of the joint?

- EdsCustomWoodCrafts

Not could but will weaken the joint. Thing is you probably were thinking of making the surface flat, which the brass thickness above the surface is what holds it together, so then it would fail. Just polish the brass if you must otherwise leave it alone. It may fail anyway – no way to know. Just get it usable and put it to work, if it holds up then do more restoration.

- OSU55


Thanks for info!!! Who ever did it didn’t do a great job .. I have seen it done where there isn’t this tumour looking thing on the side of the plane

-- Thanks Ed “A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working. ~Author unknown” . Come check out my website for more about what I make and how at www.edscustomwoodcrafts.com

View diverlloyd's profile

diverlloyd

3529 posts in 2277 days


#10 posted 09-16-2018 11:28 AM


Good to know !!! I really want to file down the braze would that weaken the integrity of the joint?

- EdsCustomWoodCrafts

Not could but will weaken the joint. Thing is you probably were thinking of making the surface flat, which the brass thickness above the surface is what holds it together, so then it would fail. Just polish the brass if you must otherwise leave it alone. It may fail anyway – no way to know. Just get it usable and put it to work, if it holds up then do more restoration.

- OSU55

Thanks for info!!! Who ever did it didn’t do a great job .. I have seen it done where there isn’t this tumour looking thing on the side of the plane

- EdsCustomWoodCrafts

If done right it should be filed down flat to the surface. A flat to the surface braze or weld is stronger then a convex one. Reason being that there is no stress points at the edges of the fix. The right way would be to drill a hole in the end or ends of the crack( this will stop the crack from continuing). Then grind a groove following the center of the crack on the back side as much as you can to about 1/2 the thickness of the casting. Clamp it down to a metal table or anything to keep it flat. Make your fix braze,silfos or weld and if clamped to the table unclamp it. The table will cause it to cool quicker. Since its cast you want it to cool slowly so it doesn’t crack(I prefer a bucket of sand) cover it or whatever to keep it from cooling to quick. Once cooled now do the same steps to the outside. Now after it’s cooled again file it flat. brazing rods with flux it will be leave a gold colored fix, silfos will be silver, you can also use pure silver to braze with. A weld will also be silver since the filler rod has a high nickle content. Old welders will say pinging the weld as it’s cool will also stop the cast from cracking. I have about a 50% success rate with pinging and about 99% with putting it in a bucket of sand. The fix shouldn’t crack it’s the surrounding material that is prone to cracking.
If you are interested then I would file down what has been done and see how well it bonded to the crack. If looks good then leave it if not then you have a good chance to learn a new skill. Just remember a proper fix should be flat a glob is going to be weaker,uglier and prone to failure.

View bandit571's profile (online now)

bandit571

23185 posts in 3103 days


#11 posted 09-16-2018 01:07 PM

Dave Bardin of Chisel & Forge has a video on how to braze a plane’s cracked side/sole….he also fixed the Millers Falls No. 14 I am using right now….and you can see it IN the video.

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View corelz125's profile

corelz125

752 posts in 1396 days


#12 posted 09-16-2018 08:24 PM

If your going to weld it a little pre heating will help to and make sure you get the correct electrode. Not all rods are made the same.

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Planeman40

1420 posts in 3180 days


#13 posted 09-17-2018 10:57 PM

If you are going to try to re-braze that crack either with brass or silver, be aware that the object is to have the braze flow completely through the crack. This is sometimes not easy to do. You must be sure to use a brazing flux that is compatible with the type of brazing you are using and you must get the crack area hot enough for the brazing material to easily melt and flow deep into the crack. this means the crack must be brought to a temperature near to the melting point of the cast iron plane body. The should be an almost, but not quite, bright white hot. You will know it when the braising material starts to melt. Hold it there for a short while (like 20 seconds or more) to allow the brazing material to flow deeply into the crack. Also, make sure you thoroughly clean the crack area to bright steel before beginning.

-- Always remember: It is a mathematical certainty that half the people in this country are below average in intelligence!

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EdsCustomWoodCrafts

928 posts in 1762 days


#14 posted 09-18-2018 12:23 AM

Thanks everyone for your input .. I am just going to restore the plane and hopefully use it on a shooting board … I’m not going to mess around with brazing primarily because I am a littler reluctant in doing metal work I’d prob make it worse … I started the rehab of it today and there is a lot of work in it..

Thanks again

-- Thanks Ed “A bad day woodworking is better than a good day working. ~Author unknown” . Come check out my website for more about what I make and how at www.edscustomwoodcrafts.com

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corelz125

752 posts in 1396 days


#15 posted 09-18-2018 12:45 AM

If the sole is pretty flat and straight there’s no worries.

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