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Delta DC 380 Planer, Pinion gear

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Forum topic by Don_P posted 05-11-2018 12:19 PM 2661 views 4 times favorited 16 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Don_P

6 posts in 699 days


05-11-2018 12:19 PM

Hi Folks, This is my first post here. I posted this on another forum and one of the guys mentioned y’all might be interested. I have an “experienced” 15” DC 380 planer that stripped the feed pinion gear, on all the parts sites you’ll see it as part #124, a spiral keyed gear that goes from the cutterhead outboard end into the feed gearbox to drive the feedworks. The part is obsolete and unavailable. I’ve been talking to a machine shop and the price break begins at a run of 25 pcs. The cost would be $45/ pc, add a bit for shipping and such, call it $50. I can probably spread around 5 of them around in my neighborhood and am trying to see if there is enough interest to have them do a run. If you have one of these machines in otherwise good shape, this is a highly stressed part, it might be worth having one on the shelf. This is the high speed, small diameter, low tooth count gear that takes all the whacks. Anyway if you are interested please let me know and if there are enough of us interested I’ll give them a go ahead.

I think email forwards here but you can also reach me at;
[email protected]


16 replies so far

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CaptainKlutz

2714 posts in 2178 days


#1 posted 05-11-2018 03:43 PM

FYI – I just finished a major rebuild on a DC-380 and know chasing parts can be challenging. I did not need to replace a pinion gear, but will share what I learned to help others:

#1: Delta built the DC-380 model in several countries; USA, Taiwan, Argentina, and most recently in China. While there are subtle variations between each generation, many parts are interchangeable. Need to use Delta model (22-XXX) number, not marketing name (DC-380) to differentiate between generations and mfg locations.

#2: There are many clones of the Delta 15” planers. Appears many clones used parts built by same mfg that Delta used in Taiwan and China for their parts.

Examples:
The Grizzly G0453 is clone of Delta. The Grizzly G1021 planer has moving table, but shares some of same cutter head parts. Grizzly has most parts available for both planers. These may fit old Delta?

Jet sells the JWP15H that is also a Delta clone. Jet has moving table version like Grizzly. Older Powermatic 15” (clone) planers used the same mfg as Jet. Jet and PowerMatic replacement parts are available from respective OEM. Another source is “machacc” on eBay.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Jet-Powermatic-15-and-20-planer-gear-and-Jet-16-planer/172287802831

If it were me needing a new pinion gear, I would buy some clone parts and hope I find one compatible. Then post the information here to help others?

#3 – Read on one of forums discussing Shellix conversion for 15” planers that there are only 2 different versions of that pinion gear inside Delta and clone 15” planers? Supposedly only difference being dimensions of key that mates to gear to end of shaft. Can not remember where I saw it, but one person posted that Byrd folks have had to deal damaged pinion gear issues as part of conversion process and knew of a source for replacements for both pinion gear types. Suggest you contact Bryd to verify if WWW rumor that these discontinued parts are available is true?

Regardless of what becomes of your post here, I congratulate your efforts to resurrect a discontinued gear part for Delta 15” planers. Offering to invest $1000+ for run of replacement gears to help yourself and others is very kind.

Best Luck.

-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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Don_P

6 posts in 699 days


#2 posted 05-11-2018 09:50 PM

Cap’n, thank you for such an informative and nice post. I have an email off to Byrd, that is genius.

Just heard back from Byrd:

Don,
If you go to ereplacementparts.com and type in the part number 6284848, it will show a picture of the pinion gear. We have sold thousand of SHELIX for the Delta 15” planer and have had one customer say that there gear was machined opposite from the one in the picture on ereplacement parts. If your gear looks like the one in the picture you will be ok but if it is machines opposite of the picture then you will probably have to have a gear made custom.
Hope this helps and if you have any questions just let us know.
Sara

I just ordered one, I’ll update when it gets in.

Needless to say you’re treetop tall in my shop tonight!

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Fred Hargis

6059 posts in 3177 days


#3 posted 05-12-2018 10:44 AM

Now how cool is that? Glad you may have a solution in hand, looking forward to the update (as a 380 owner).

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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Peteybadboy

1723 posts in 2633 days


#4 posted 05-12-2018 11:20 AM

Good forum, I have a DC 380 as well. I did upgrade to the Byrd as well.

-- Petey

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Don_P

6 posts in 699 days


#5 posted 05-21-2018 12:34 AM

Strike one, the part number above doesn’t fit, if someone has a 15” powermatic holler and its yours.

It appears the Jet is reverse spiral and obsolete as well.

I just ordered the Grizzly, will let y’all know…

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Don_P

6 posts in 699 days


#6 posted 05-27-2018 10:28 PM

It looks like the Grizzly pinion gear fit. I just did a short test fire and it seems fine. Thanks everyone for your help!
P0453535 GEAR 14T

The Powermatic gear I tried first was a little larger, left hand spiral and 16 tooth. The Grizzly is right hand and 14 tooth. The Powermatic was about $18+ shipping IIRC, the Grizzly was $4.75 + 9.99 shipping, no way I could order something that was half the price of shipping, I felt lucky and ordered two for the same shipping :D. The machining and steel looks less than stellar on all of these including the oem, I’ll holler back if it fails soon.

While I was reassembling I took a couple of pics of the last problem I had with the planer. Notice how loose the right hand feed chain is, there is no tensioner on it where there is one on the rear chain. Those are all replacement sprockets and chains not stretched or worn out. This caused the chain to hop teeth on the original sprockets and tore the teeth up. (the pinion gear I replaced this time lives behind those sprockets in that center gearbox just about behind the tensioner, check your oil in that I was very low.)
[img]timbertoolbox.com/cp/drivechain1.jpg [/img]

I drilled through the chain cover, lower right, in a place that would take up some of the slack and improve the wrap on the sprockets then slid a wooden thread spool over a small bolt and nutted that on. Not a tensioner, just taking up some of the slack. That seems to work, it’s had I guess 10-20mbf through it since that and hasn’t hopped again.
[img]timbertoolbox.com/cp/drivechain2.jpg [/img]

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CaptainKlutz

2714 posts in 2178 days


#7 posted 05-28-2018 03:43 PM

Glad you found a compatible part.

Regarding chain tension:
One typical roller chain failure mechanism is stretching. The stamped metal side plates on links actually stretch under heavy use, and chain might need replaced? It is very hard to see, but can be measured. Rule of thumb in roller chain applications is the if you replace the sprocket due wear/breakage, then you need to replace chain as well. Believe replacement roller chains for DC-380 are still available from Delta?

Also Roller chain is relatively easy to adjust length via removing/adding links. Usually all you need is ‘chain breaker’ tool. Depending on pivot pin size, common <$10 tool used on bicycle chain will work to remove/install pins.
Most roller chain sizes also have available a 1/2 size link called an offset link.

FWIW –
The feed roller drive chain on my DC-380 (22-675) is suspiciously loose similar to your mention, but it works? While investigating the tension peculiarity, did notice that some of the newer clone 15” & 20” models using same gear box design, added a second tension wheel? Your solution appears to be another interesting option.

Thanks for sharing the pinion solution.

-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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Don_P

6 posts in 699 days


#8 posted 05-28-2018 06:55 PM

I actually replaced the sprockets as well as both chains. The original chains were the same length as the new ones so even though the chain had taken almost all the teeth off the sprocket it doesn’t seem to have stretched visibly. I was suprised at how slack the replaced chain was, that was the reason for my improvised roller. This planer usually lives behind my sawmill and sees severe duty rough dimensioning then has travelled to multiple jobsites and run miles of trim and panelling. The reason I bought the top moving planer was to set it up with roller tables front and rear and pass everything from boards up to 6x timbers through it. That worked fairly well but I had to be careful of bow, an upward bowed timber riding the rollers would lift the planer and slam it into the rollers. I now use a planer head on a swingblade mill to joint and dimension timbers which does a better job and spares this little workhorse. All in all I’ve been very happy with this machine

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runswithscissors

3083 posts in 2709 days


#9 posted 05-29-2018 04:20 AM

I bought a 13” Rockwell/Invicta (made in Brazil) for a really good price off CL. The chain had broken, and piled up inside the chain cover, breaking the casting into several parts.

No Delta chain was available, and my local hardware store did not have metric chain. So off I went to Grizzly (I live a few miles from the Bellingham facility), and the sales clerk helped me confirm that my chain was metric. The new Grizzly chain fit perfectly after adjustment for length, and the chain cover wasn’t hard to fab out of 1/8” plate steel. But after I was done with that job, I realized why so many parts like that are cast iron: way less labor intensive to simply cast hundreds of identical parts.

That was an excellent planer. I was just about to pull the trigger on a Byrd helical head, when I changed my mind and went another direction, however.

-- I admit to being an adrenaline junky; fortunately, I'm very easily frightened

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BoomerBuilt

2 posts in 228 days


#10 posted 01-07-2020 07:02 AM

This is a great feed you guys. I appreciate it all.
I am just starting out on my DC-380 fix up. I picked it up from a fellow in the woodworkers guild. He sold it to me at a great price. He said he felt like he got his moneys worth out of it. I was told one roller bearing (seems like it’s a bushing now that i see the parts list) is going, as well as the knives needed to be changed. I have had it about 3 years and am just getting to it all now. Neither was so bad that i needed to get to them immediately. And as a new mom, my time in the woodshed has been greatly diminished. With my husbands help i got the entire head off the stand, and have convinced my husband of a table we can work on it in the mud room. Hehe.

We also looked at the chains and really thought they needed a tensioner like you mention Don_p . So it was neat to see you mention that. Are you liking your new piece you added to your planer to combat the slack? I will need a new top tensioner anyways. Mines rubbing on the side of the casing.

Next up I am considering taking off all the things that roll underneath and checking the bushings/ bearings since i am there. Is that hard to do? The 62,63,64,65 (spring pin and set screws etc.. look possibly hard to put back together?).

And yes good call on the oil. I know when i checked the manual it said to top up often. The previous owner had never done anything oil related.

Also my outfeed roller on half of it looks warped. Almost a little melted and not smooth all on the one half… Don’t know it’s function enough to know if that matters… i can’t see why it does…

Anything else i am missing that i should forsure check that i might not have thought of? Cheers to you both.

Janessa

-- You never know what you don’t know.

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therealSteveN

5232 posts in 1258 days


#11 posted 01-07-2020 07:34 AM

I have one of the many licensed DC-380 knock offs, and there are a lot of them around. Owners will say it looks just like a 380, but only sports a 2HP motor. Parts are completely interchangeable as Delta allowed the total copy of their 3 Hp machine, with the only caveat, the knock offs only use 2HP. Probably at least doubles the total number, if not tripling it. Post war they were a tool for the handy shop guy to have behind a TS, Jointer, or RAS.

-- Think safe, be safe

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CaptainKlutz

2714 posts in 2178 days


#12 posted 01-07-2020 11:45 AM


Next up I am considering taking off all the things that roll underneath and checking the bushings/ bearings since i am there. Is that hard to do? The 62,63,64,65 (spring pin and set screws etc.. look possibly hard to put back together?).

Janessa
- BoomerBuilt

Removing the feed roller bushings is easy?
Challenge is that you have to remove the sprockets/chain that connect everything to gear box.
Bolt #65 holds the plate on the head casting that supports the bushing/roller. #62/63 is used to set the height of rollers relative to the table and is something you will probably be adjusting after reassembly. Adjustment is in the manual.
Spring #60 is best removed from top. Remove Allen screw #138 from top to reach the sprin. Also clean out the oiling channel. It accumulates dust, and can get impacted to point that oil won’t flow down to bushing. You want to at least remove the top Allen screw to release the pressure on the feed roller bushings before removal. The spring will come out top or bottom.
If you put (2) 2×4 on the table, and lower the head till it just touches, the rollers are supported and removing the feed roller hardware is ‘piece of cake’.

Not fan of this bushing design? Thanks to heavy spring pressure on feed rollers, It is the one part that I needed to replace on all 5 planers I have rebuilt over the years. IME – Grizzly has been cheapest place to get new bushings (P1021153) and they always been in stock? The Grizzly bushing fit my; Delta, Powermatic, Jet, and a General planers.

Rebuilt a Powermatic PM15, and it was worn so bad the metal out feed roller was rubbing on the gear box casting. The bushing opening was elongated by ~1/4”. Here is a pic:

The out feed roller had excessive wear in the bearing area and it needed replacing also. PM uses an all metal out feed roller (like Grizzly G1021), unlike the Delta which is rubber covered. When I tore it down and saw the bushing/shaft wear, was amazed that the tool was actually in service when I bought it. Just proves these 15” planers are hard to kill.

The manual recommends a weekly task of adding a couple drops of oil to top of machine, to keep those bushings and feed rollers lubed. IMHO- if tool is only used occasionally, suggest you should put 2-3 drops of oil on those bushings every work session. :-)

If decide to fix the damaged out feed roller rubber, there are two paths: Can still buy OEM replacement part 1349339, or if the shaft is not worn at bearings – can get the existing one re-covered. If can find a local place that repairs commercial printer rollers, they can replace rubber. If not, have seen posts that Western Roller will do the work.

Last but not least for anyone reading this post thinking they can replace an all metal out feed roller with Delta rubber coated version:
It might or might not fit!
Based on my rebuilds, it appears there are 3 different 15” planer mfg, with very slight differences between them (mostly in head/gear box casting). One difference is the length of the feed roller shafts. The Delta OEM unit is ~10mm to short for some clone units. Grizzly recently made the clone planer parts hunt even more interesting; they now sell rubber out feed roller upgrades for the Taiwan made G1021 (Delta 22-680 3HP clone). In past the only one available was for the Chinese made G0453.
Be very interested if anyone buys the new Grizzly T30533 part for a Delta, and it fits. The part is ~$45 less than Delta OEM. :-0)

Best Luck.

-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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Peteybadboy

1723 posts in 2633 days


#13 posted 01-07-2020 12:20 PM

Try Ereplacementparts.com? So far they have provided all kinds of parts for stuff tha has stopped working.

I did a quick scan – The DC380 is not listed. Maybe if you had the part # they might have it?

-- Petey

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

6059 posts in 3177 days


#14 posted 01-07-2020 12:48 PM

DC 380 isn’t going to get you a parts list, you need the model number…on mine it’s 22-680 (circa 2000 model). You should have a tag right under the cutterhead on the belt drive side. BTW, I had problems with the roller bushing jamming on mine, causing the machine to chatter. When I took the thing apart, I found the bearing surface in the hole simply needed cleaning to get the dried lube and crap off, then re-oil.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

View CaptainKlutz's profile

CaptainKlutz

2714 posts in 2178 days


#15 posted 01-07-2020 01:06 PM


Try Ereplacementparts.com? So far they have provided all kinds of parts for stuff tha has stopped working.
I did a quick scan – The DC380 is not listed. Maybe if you had the part # they might have it?
- Peteybadboy

Hmm,

https://www.ereplacementparts.com/delta-planer-parts-c-3275_3571.html

The common Delta 15” DC-380 planer PN are 22-680, 22-681, 22-780, 22-790. They also sold models with ‘Y’, ‘X’ and other suffix for models with more features like different out feed tables, or different base/cabinet.

Chasing 25-35 year old Delta parts is much harder than quick trip to one site.

Difficulty with ereplacement parts is many Delta 15” planer parts are not stocked, and have to be ordered from Delta. Worse is when Delta has to order them from mfg, and they have 2-6 month lead times.

Sometimes the only choice is dealing with fleabay or an unauthorized 3rd party like renovoparts.com to find stuff. Renovo bought several parts warehouses from Black & Decker after they leveraged the Delta buyout and needed cash to make investors happy. Many tons of old parts were scrapped in the process. Have rebuilt two Delta planners and both times I ended up with majority of parts from Grizzly as Delta doesn’t support less popular parts anymore. Fleabay and Renovo were only sites with rubber outfeed roller in stock when I needed one.
as always, YMMV

-- If it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have no luck at all, - Albert King - Born Under a Bad Sign released 1967

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