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Looking for simple explaination on wiring size for 3 hp single phase motor?

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Forum topic by DocSavage45 posted 04-10-2018 02:04 AM 15041 views 0 times favorited 23 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


04-10-2018 02:04 AM

Topic tags/keywords: question dust collector

Hey LJ’s,

Started to look at assembly instructions and specifications for my new 3 hp dust collector.

This is after I struggled and succeeded running two 30 amp lines, 30 feet through 1/2 inch metal conduit , had an electrician consult, screwed up bending the conduit but got it on the 3rd try. Walked back and forth, pushed and pulled and finally was successful.

On to setting up my new 3 hp Grizzly dust collector. Also a new remote 220 3.5 hp Long Ranger from PSI ( Dust Collector in a Garden Shed next to the shop).

Looking inside the remote receiver I found wires of the type I use to wire a door bell? Can these handle the load from the motor? Then look at specifications regarding the line cord for the dust collector? 14 awg????? Won’t that be harmful?

I’m running number ten awg wire to the outlets per electrician suggestion for 3 hp motor.

The specs for grizzly are a 20 amp circuit? Hugh?

Have looked on other forum topics regarding wiring. And some engineering sites that even suggest a 14 gauge wire at the end leg of a circuit run without ground fault as it’s 3 wire.

Somewhere I have read that smaller wire sizes and cause loss of efficiency and overheating wear on the motor? Being that the Dust Collector will be the most run motor I want to keep it healthy and efficient.

My second concern is about the small wire sizes in the remote which is supposed to be designed for a 3.5 hp motor?

I’m setting it up and do not want to do this again. so I thought I’d pose the questions here and see if I’d get a tech savvy relatively simple answer. LOL!

Thanks!

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher


23 replies so far

View darthford's profile

darthford

612 posts in 2405 days


#1 posted 04-10-2018 02:42 AM

The remote likely only draws a fraction of 1 amp to activate a relay, likely a magnetic relay, which is the switch that turns the dust collector motor on/off when you operated the remote. So the coil side of the relay (what makes the relay switch open and close) uses very little current hence a small gauge wire.

Now that said for the motor side of this yeah heavy gauge wire. Be advised dust collectors can draw a LOT of peak current at start up and trip a breaker that’s too close to the rated amp draw. I had the smaller Grizzly cyclone at one point, wired 220v to a 20 amp circuit it kept tripped the circuit breaker. It was drawing a peak of 50 amps at start up. I ended up going with a 30 amp circuit breaker, may have even been a slow trip type that allows for that brief peak amp draw at start up without tripping.

View CRAIGCLICK's profile

CRAIGCLICK

117 posts in 554 days


#2 posted 04-10-2018 03:12 AM

Don’t really have much to add EXCEPT, next time you have to pull wire thrpugh conduit, use this…you can thank me later!

-- Somewhere between raising hell and amazing grace.

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#3 posted 04-10-2018 03:45 AM

darthford,

Did your machine have a 14 awg line cord?

Thanks, I am going forward.

Tanks for your thoughts, still looks like a pretty flimsy power switch.

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#4 posted 04-10-2018 03:47 AM

CRAIGCLICK,

Yep, used it still a struggle, but I had the 1/2 inch conduit from past projects.

Thanks!

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View TheFridge's profile

TheFridge

10859 posts in 1967 days


#5 posted 04-10-2018 05:11 AM

Fishtape make life easy fo shizzle

14/3 SJOOW cord has a maximum ampacity of 18A. 3HP motor rates at 17A. Aside from the obvious, I should know how to explain this right but it’s late and my brain hurts.

Typically, if it’s part of a listed assembly you only worry about the cord end, if that. Pretty sure a bunch of grizzly stuff isn’t listed but I’m just gonna roll with my first answer for now. There maybe be codes that apply but I can’t think of them at the moment.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

View go4tech's profile

go4tech

26 posts in 1506 days


#6 posted 04-10-2018 06:19 AM

Believe that you are attempting to sort from a wrong direction.

1) Use a 2 pole, 240V, >30A contactor (like: Packard C240B Packard Contactor 2 Pole 40 Amps 120 Coil Voltage) ~$9,
2) Put the contactor inline with the line to be switched. Hot side to input and Load to Switched side.
3) Get a cheap, low wattage RF wireless switch that will switch 110V (like: Woods 32555WD Outdoor Wireless Remote Control Kit, Weatherproof, 100ft Range) ~$10
4) Install the RF Switch in series from the hot input side to the coil voltage (use 110V to match the pull in coil voltage if switching 220V). (Recommend taking apart the housing to get to the actual switched leads. My case was very easy to do.). If wanted, you can use actually outlets, but gets large that way.
5) Works like a champ!

How it works:

RF link closes a 110V switch connected to the pull in coil.
Pull in coil closes the main contactor.

The current in the pull in coil is very low. Does not stress the the capacity of the RF controlled switch.
Motor operation current is handled by the Contractor side. Designed to be hot switched.
Will last for years.

Hope this helps.

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#7 posted 04-10-2018 07:12 AM

go4tech,

Thanks. It’s interesting that out of more than 3000 views I got 4 close answers. I already have the Lone Ranger and I don’t believe I can return it as I have had it for awhile thinking it would do the job. It may or may not, and I can investigate your recommendation.

What are your thoughts on the input cord ?

Thanks!

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#8 posted 04-10-2018 07:14 AM

Fridge, Thanks for your headache input. I’m thinking number 12 or higher line cord.

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View Loren's profile

Loren

10477 posts in 4129 days


#9 posted 04-10-2018 08:52 AM

I have a 115v cyclone and another dc I use for
heavier work. For the cyclone I ran a wire for
a ceiling drop with a switch on it. In that case
it actually interupts the current, but I suspect
what your high-tech remote is doing is tripping
a switch close to the motor.

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

5687 posts in 2974 days


#10 posted 04-10-2018 10:42 AM

If you want more details about a remote like go4tech described, here is a good write up. Realizing you have what you have and ,might not be interested….but one day if you (like i did) drop your FOB once to often onto the concrete floor, you might find it doesn’t work anymore. As for the cord, I’m surprised they would put 14 gauge on a 3.5 HP motor. I’d want that to be at least 12 gauge, but that’s just me.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

View MrUnix's profile

MrUnix

7468 posts in 2680 days


#11 posted 04-10-2018 11:25 AM

Not sure which one you have, but the specs for both the 3hp DC systems at the Grizzly site state that the motor draws 12A… so 14ga will work, but 12ga would be much better IMO.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#12 posted 04-10-2018 07:33 PM

Loren,

Thanks, I’m problem solving with the help of LJ’s I worked in electronics since I was a kid. What I am wanting to do during the installation of hopefully a more efficient ,healthier dust collection is not have overload on the motor. I am down to the assembly of the dust collector and found what I believed from my past to be a potential problem.

I have learned some new information I should have gotten before purchasing the supposed high end remote.

Wire diameter is like a water pipe a bigger motor needs more juice/amperage. Did not see how this was going to work, but I can’t return the remote as I have had it too long.

I also have limited funds so I’m doing this myself. LOL!

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#13 posted 04-10-2018 07:35 PM

Fred,

I may need the information if my high end remote craps out???? Not laughing here.

Thanks

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View DocSavage45's profile

DocSavage45

8856 posts in 3323 days


#14 posted 04-10-2018 07:42 PM

Brad,

I’ve pushed and pulled as well as screwed up some conduit and I have more than 30 feet of number 10 wire to account for load drop due to distance only to find lamp cord in a nice case for the last 6 feet.

As you know Murphy has residence in my shop. So I am doing my best to remember all of his lessons planning and making sure. I also had a licensed electrician recommend what he would do and that will pass code.

Thanks for checking out what Grizzly recommends.

-- Cau Haus Designs, Thomas J. Tieffenbacher

View TheFridge's profile

TheFridge

10859 posts in 1967 days


#15 posted 04-10-2018 09:40 PM



Not sure which one you have, but the specs for both the 3hp DC systems at the Grizzly site state that the motor draws 12A… so 14ga will work, but 12ga would be much better IMO.

Cheers,
Brad

- MrUnix

Ditto.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

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