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Perhaps the blade is not properly hardened? A good blacksmith could fix that.
Why is this Hard Maple instant death to the edge of hand planes?
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If a hand plane is hard to use, You should hear my 12 " surface planer on a 12" wide maple board. Quite a few years ago, I was able to buy rough kiln dried lumber for about a dollar a board foot. These folks had a solar powered kiln made mostly out of plastic sheeting. It worked great! I got a 12" X 8 ft. piece of hard maple for about $10.00. Also got some cherry and red oak. Made several wall hanging quilt racks(Shelf with place to hang the quilt below the shelf.)
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I've read that sometimes there's better steel back a bit from the factory edge. Since the OP is already double bevel sharpening I can't suggest much in that regard. Brian Burns developed his double bevel system to plane hard maple specifically.
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I am assuming you are referring only to WoodchuckerNJ's experience and not mine. It is probably quite a stretch to jump to the idea a blade in a modern plane has not been hardened properly. I know things can go wrong, but still very low odds.
We must have very different definitions of what constitutes a "good blacksmith"
. To me, a good blacksmith is someone who is skilled at manipulating hot steel with a hammer, can make ornamental iron work, wrought gates and hinges, steel roses and so on. I know three smiths who are also skilled blade smiths, forging pattern welded swords, spear heads, wood working tools (green wood work), one even made Wootz katanas from steel he smelted himself. I would not trust any of them to re-harden a finished plane blade and think it would be unfair to ask, no reflection upon their skills. In the case of the Wootz artist, he had been doing his thing for decades and had never heat treated O-1 tool steel, didn't know what he didn't know and didn't have the gear to do it properly. To reharden without causing de-carb or distortion would be a feat and would rely upon equipment, if not knowledge, that is little needed in normal blacksmith work.
There are places that heat treat knife blades, per blade (Peters, Paul Bos, Texas knife makers, Tru Grit, Jarrod Todd to name a few), and they would be much better than a blacksmith. Not that I think anyone needs to get a plane blade re-hardened!
Chris
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I am assuming you are referring only to WoodchuckerNJ's experience and not mine. It is probably quite a stretch to jump to the idea a blade in a modern plane has not been hardened properly. I know things can go wrong, but still very low odds.
We must have very different definitions of what constitutes a "good blacksmith"
I know three smiths who are also skilled blade smiths, forging pattern welded swords, spear heads, wood working tools (green wood work), one even made Wootz katanas from steel he smelted himself. I would not trust any of them to re-harden a finished plane blade and think it would be unfair to ask, no reflection upon their skills. In the case of the Wootz artist, he had been doing his thing for decades and had never heat treated O-1 tool steel, didn't know what he didn't know and didn't have the gear to do it properly. To reharden without causing de-carb or distortion would be a feat and would rely upon equipment, if not knowledge, that is little needed in normal blacksmith work.
There are places that heat treat knife blades, per blade (Peters, Paul Bos, Texas knife makers, Tru Grit, Jarrod Todd to name a few), and they would be much better than a blacksmith. Not that I think anyone needs to get a plane blade re-hardened!
Chris
Look at Woodcraft Supply for replacement plane blades. Even a highly skilled craftsman can turn out a blade that is not hardened enough.
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Nice site. Sadly it is easier for me to shop domestically than order from over seas. Even though the Woodcraft prices look good they are not good enough to offset the $40 shipping never mind the possible tax and fees. I tend to order from Classic Hand Tools. Since I had the same thing happen on three planes, all with fairly premium blades from different sources/times, I am betting there is nothing wrong with the HT. And if I really wanted to, I could take the blades to work and get them hardness checked in the materials lab.
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where are you? Woodcraft Supply is in Parkersburg, WV.
A couple thoughts:
1. My understanding is opposite to what others have written: If the edge is failing, then you need a larger bevel angle, knot smaller. I would try 35 degrees, not 25.
2. You may not be getting the burr off completely when sharpening. Since you get good shavings in other woods, this is less likely. One way to test is to sharpen as normal, then put the fresh edge onto a piece of scrap oak, and rap the end of the blade with a mallet, driving the edge into the wood. Now feel the edge for a burr. If there, either you didn't get the burr off, or the edge failed, which means you need a steeper bevel angle. Oh, make sure to orient the edge crosswise to the grain, not along the grain. If the edge survives this in oak, you can try it on a bit of your maple. This may help you explore for how steep the bevel angle needs to be and help you explore whether this is edge failure or edge destruction (from abrasive particles in the wood).
3. If you are only smoothing, not dimensioning, you could try a scraper
4. I find that wiping difficult wood with denatured alcohol can help the blade cut. I've only done this with small, cranky sections, like around knots and reversing grain, not a whole surface, but you could try. The alcohol will flash off quickly, so you will need to figure out how to manage that and how to manage the vapors.
5. Is there any chance that the edge failure is happening when entering the wood rather than during the cut itself? On occasion, I will plane a small chamfer onto the leading edge of the work (a couple swipes with the plane) and apply oil to that chamfer. I have camellia oil, but you could use 3-in-1, I'd guess. This can help the iron enter the cut. I do this at times when I am having trouble with juddering during the start. Maybe it will help here?
For whatever it's worth, I remember trying to plane paint off of some cabinet doors that I wanted to upcycle. I have no idea what that stuff was, but it was a blade killer. Plane blades, scraper blades...didn't matter. Instant death. I used scrapers because I could turn an edge quickly a few times. It was almost certainly minerals added to the paint since this was some sort of pearly iridescent stuff.
1. My understanding is opposite to what others have written: If the edge is failing, then you need a larger bevel angle, knot smaller. I would try 35 degrees, not 25.
2. You may not be getting the burr off completely when sharpening. Since you get good shavings in other woods, this is less likely. One way to test is to sharpen as normal, then put the fresh edge onto a piece of scrap oak, and rap the end of the blade with a mallet, driving the edge into the wood. Now feel the edge for a burr. If there, either you didn't get the burr off, or the edge failed, which means you need a steeper bevel angle. Oh, make sure to orient the edge crosswise to the grain, not along the grain. If the edge survives this in oak, you can try it on a bit of your maple. This may help you explore for how steep the bevel angle needs to be and help you explore whether this is edge failure or edge destruction (from abrasive particles in the wood).
3. If you are only smoothing, not dimensioning, you could try a scraper
4. I find that wiping difficult wood with denatured alcohol can help the blade cut. I've only done this with small, cranky sections, like around knots and reversing grain, not a whole surface, but you could try. The alcohol will flash off quickly, so you will need to figure out how to manage that and how to manage the vapors.
5. Is there any chance that the edge failure is happening when entering the wood rather than during the cut itself? On occasion, I will plane a small chamfer onto the leading edge of the work (a couple swipes with the plane) and apply oil to that chamfer. I have camellia oil, but you could use 3-in-1, I'd guess. This can help the iron enter the cut. I do this at times when I am having trouble with juddering during the start. Maybe it will help here?
For whatever it's worth, I remember trying to plane paint off of some cabinet doors that I wanted to upcycle. I have no idea what that stuff was, but it was a blade killer. Plane blades, scraper blades...didn't matter. Instant death. I used scrapers because I could turn an edge quickly a few times. It was almost certainly minerals added to the paint since this was some sort of pearly iridescent stuff.
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OP is in Great Britain, see flag under their name!
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When refinishing a grand piano, I often needed to remove several layers of very old and dry varnish. I found that the best way was to sharpen my scraper, then apply enough pressure to cut all the way through all the layers of varnish clear down to the stained wood in the first pass. It was kinda hard to pull the scraper but would not dull it quite as quickly. In many cases, there was a layer of shellac under the varnish and it would scrape down to the shellac pretty easily. Even a rather dull scraper would cut down to the shellac.
Thanks for sharing. I've forgotten the name of the Stanley tool that is pretty much a #80 cabinet scraper blade on the end of a stick / handle. Stanley 82? Is that what you were using? You saying, "pull the scraper" makes it sound like it might have been. I'm picturing doing what you described on the vertical surfaces and am thinking that was a tough job!
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, I live in the United Kingdom now. The flags next to folks names are good….if you recognise the flag, I think there is room to improve the forum interface with a written Location note. The US is big enough that it can be handy to know if a person is working with conditions in Arizona vs Maine, never mind folk from outs the US.
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I do hollow grind, but my other hobby is knife making and I grind a lot of those in the hard state. I am using a variable speed 72” belt grinder with 10” contact wheel and ceramic belts. I don’t get the grind close enough to the edge, or hot enough, to change temper. There is a lot more metal at a plane edge than at a knife edge to dissipate heat.
Temper refers to the post quench treatment to make steel less brittle…less hard. Re-tempering is what you might try if a blade chips and you want it softer.
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