LumberJocks Woodworking Forum banner
  • Please post in our Community Feedback thread for help with the new forum software! If you are having trouble logging in, please Contact Us for assistance.
1 - 20 of 31 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Hello LJ'ers,

I am planning to build a table saw station but have a headache I have to work around. When my barn's floor was poured it began to rain and they almost lost the floor, this is according to the original owner, due to this the barn floor is very uneven. I plan on the station being 8' x 8'. In a 8' span there can be as much as 1.5" of difference in the floor. The station is going to be very heavy with a table saw, router station and a bunch of drawers and cabinets to store a number of items. My concern is building the base "stout" enough to handle the weight. Honestly, I have already built something similar and have problems with it sagging, so I know the potential for big problems if the base is not real stout. Now since you know the boat I'm in, I thought I would throw my problem to the masses and ask, "If you were in my shoes, how would you build the base to handle the weight?" I am open to any idea's so that I can weight all of them and feel confident I will come up with the right way to go once I've heard from all of ya'll.

Thanks ahead of time for any help extended,
Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,908 Posts
I would build the base using 4 X 4 legs with adjusters on the bottom to adjust to the unevenness of the floor. The number of legs would depend on how you design everything else. If I knew more of what you want and where I think I could help you more.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks Jerry, when you say "if I knew more of what your want", what kind of additional information do you need? I will be more than glad to explain further.

Thanks for your reply,
Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
78 Posts
Build an 8'x8' frame out of 2×4's. lay it on the floor where you want to put your TS station. fill the area with a self leveling concrete until the area is nice and flat. You may need to scribe the 2×4's to the floor in order to keep the concrete from coming out the bottom.

dan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks again Jerry. I don't mean to be dense, but are you referring to Sketch-up or just hand draw something? I don't know how to use Sketch-up so I guess that would rule that out. I began hand drawing, last night, but stopped cause I started thinking about this base problem and decided that I would post a question on LJ to see what others would do to attack this problem, so I do not have a drawing, at this time. I guess this question is more involved than what I realized it would be.

Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Thanks for your reply Dan. I did think along those lines but began to wonder if I would need to attach the new concrete pad to the barn floor and how much mixing that would involve. 8' x 8' would be a lot of concrete. The good side of doing this way would be that the base is attached to the floor and really shouldn't go anywhere. Another thought is, would a pier and beam type base work?

Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
234 Posts
Shane,

Assuming you will never want to move the cabinet/saw… I would use straight KD stock (1×4 or 2×6) that spans the the distance. Using wedges, level these boards, then scribe/cut them to the floor. This will give you a very stable base.

If you want to move it around your shop, then find a level spot, build your cabinet with space for leveling feet. Rockler carries a couple different leveling feet:

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=5217&filter=adjustable%20feet
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=2053

If you look at Home Depot, Lowes, or Ace, you will find threaded feet (Rockler "polished nickel glides") that can be used with tee nuts to level.

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=388&filter=threaded%20insert
http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=1592&filter=threaded%20insert

Good luck,

Doug
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,123 Posts
Shane, I would listen to Jerry, when the day comes when you need to move it to a different location either in or out of your shop the adjusters woyld allow you to easily adjust to the new location.Sorry Dan, I just think that we've become to mobile to set in concrete. (pun intended)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thanks Julian, if I did go this way what should be the starting thickness of this pad be? One side is going to be thicker than the other so how thick should the thin side be?

Thanks in advance,
Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Thanks for the replies. I really don't see the station moving once it's built but I guess one should always plan for anything being possible. As far as the levelers go, remember that I have already built something similar and I used Rockler levelers on that project and it did sag under weight. The station/table is 4' x 8' and I used 6 levelers, 3 down each 8' span. Stating the obvious, I guess, I would assume that if I am going to use levelers then I would need to use more than I did or I would need to frame the base better than I did. One of the thoughts that I keep having is, if I use levelers then I am essentially using "legs" and legs do not seem as stable as they should/could be. As you can tell, I am new to projects and woodworking, so I apologize a head of time for my lack of understanding. Doug said to use KD stock, could someone please tell me what that is? Thanks

Thanks for all the replies,
Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
234 Posts
Shane,

Sorry, KD = Kiln Dried

I was trying to say not to use the wet 2x? from Home Depot. You want something that once you scribe it to the floor, it will stay that way.

You bring up a good point on the support. 3 support feet in 8' on your old table, no wonder you had sag. When I was suggesting laying out the boards to scribe to the floor, my mental picture was one board every two feet because you were describing a heavy load. So, I was already at twice your original support. Using that same 2' on center (both directions), I would have put 15 feet on your old table. Using the tee nuts and threaded feet is not expensive.

What material do you plan to use?

Doug
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Thanks Doug, I did have the base framed with 2×4's and they were on 2 foot centers. The Rockler levelers I put at each corner and one at four foot. As far as the material I plan to use, since I already used 2×4's I was wondering if 2×6's would be a better way to go or if I use 2×4's then should I frame it better than before. I like the scribing idea cause that would allow the base to make total contact and that seem to make it more durable. Now the scribing part seems complicated. Getting the base level by cutting the angles correctly.

Thanks for taking the time to lend a hand Doug,
Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
900 Posts
If you are going on top of existing concrete, you can get away with about 1" for the thin side. I would also suggest using a bonding agent like this to ensure a good bond between the new poor and the existing floor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thanks Julian, I am sure glad you suggested the bonding agent cause I was wondering how I would bond to the existing concrete without drilling a bunch of holes and using re-bar. Also, thanks for answering the question on the thin side of the concrete. Something more to ponder now.

Shane
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
37 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks Dan, I guess that was somewhat helpful??? The floor is over 4000 sq. ft. so I think I would rather find an alternative to your idea.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
298 Posts
When setting up a shop flexibility is always desirable, you just never know how you might want to change things in the future, so I would never recommend a permanent pad.

Your problem is nothing more than a cabinet installation project on an unlevel floor. One of the easiest ways to deal with it (when installing cabinets) is to build a separate toe kick platform that is shimmed to be level. However, given the free-standing and the extra weight of this project, I would recommend scribing the platform to make it level and thus providing a full bearing surface of the toe kick on the floor . There is an additional issue of preventing the wicking of moisture from the concrete floor to the cabinetry, using either a vapor barrier or pressure treated lumber would eliminate this problem.

Regarding your previous problems with sagging, this is a structural problem (deflection actually). There are 3 ways to deal with this:

1. Shorten the spans (ie add more legs as Doug suggests)
2. Stiffen the horizontal material to eliminate the deflection
3. Do a combination of 1. and 2.

I would probably build a 'toe kick' platform with interior webbing and a 'skin' (think one-sided torsion box). Then build the cabinets verticals with 3/4 plywood (double thick as needed for extra strength). The horizontals would be 3/4 ply, (also doubled as needed for strength and deflection) and if I had a really long span I would build a torsion box.

You can actually figure out the plywood deflections if you want to take the time, plywood design capacities.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
234 Posts
Shane,

My thought process to building was formed by working for my Dad, who owned a cabinet shop for 50+ years. We built custom cabinets, and I was involved in everything from measurement through installation.

I don't know what you have built in the past, but I would build it like a normal cabinet, in sections, once you have the level base. Like JLSmith suggested, plywood is the way to go for the main cabinet. If you scribe it to the floor, or use feet, I think plywood will give you a better product under the cabinet because its more stable.

With the level base, and station in sections, attach plywood partitions to the plywood base. This allows you to keep the work station square. If there is a section that will carry an extra heavy load, reinforce it with 2×4s (that's what we did with oven cabinets). I would use lumber to face frame out the cabinet.

That's what I would do. It will be something you will be seeing/using every time you go into the shop. Don't go cheap.

Doug
 
1 - 20 of 31 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top