While I generally agree with you, I have bought a few tools that once I got them home, turned out to be junk upon the first use. I bought a pneumatic crown stapler from Harbor Freight because I needed it for a single repair job. After 15 minutes trying and failing to make it work correctly, I boxed it up and took it back and then bought a Metabo one and within 15 minutes my task was complete. It was about 3 times the price of the HF one but 1/100th the hassle.

 

"Fit for purpose" That phrase has kept my costs in check with many hobbies. For some, it drove me to lower cost products. For some - much more expensive products!

Cheap meant something different to me years ago though, it will probably mean something different to me years from now too.

Glad you found what works best for you.

 

I like these words I came across.
The first is the quote,"I do not prize the word “cheap.” It is not a badge of honor. It is a symbol of despair. Cheap prices make cheap goods; cheap goods make for cheap men; and cheap men make for a cheap country."

 

“Cheap” is an insult. The “best” is usually the most expensive. “Cost effective” implies good use of limited funds. Sometimes that’s the most expensive tool, sometimes the cheapest.

For me “the best” is what I can afford given the task at hand, future potential use, and what’s readily available. I don’t really like my cheapest tools, but they get the job done and I don’t use them that often.

 

[/QUOTE]Agreed on many of the thoughts. When approaching a tool purchase I kind of follow a theme: For the things you use the most, pay the most. If I use it every day, i will pay more. I have been disappointed with the higher priced option and pleased with the less expensive.

 

I have had similar experience with HF. tools. I bought an angle grinder from HF for a small job but it got too hot to handle within minutes and took it back. I bought a DeWalt and no issues. Some tools at HF are ok but others are not worth it.

 

As indicated by my signature statement, we often focus too much attention on our selection of tools. "If I just had the right tools, I could build that beautiful wooden chair!" Nonsense! Our ancestors fashioned furniture with crude implements. The task took planning and skill acquired over years.

 

How many Pfeil's do you own?

 

My best example is a flexible flush-cutting saw I bought at Harbor Freight many years ago. I think it was $5-6 at the time. I’ve used it mostly for trimming dowels off from pinned tenon joints. I truly can’t imagine how any more costly saw could do a better job.

 

If that is the same saw I bought from HF, it was made in Japan and that is the reason why I bought it. It works great like any tool made in Japan I would expect to do.

 

Sneaky way to start another "Let's all bash Harbor Freight...." thread.

Actually, I was just in that store yesterday.....

95% of my tools are older than I am. The few power tools from H-F are STILL in use, BTW.

NOTE: You CAN INDEED return almost any tool to H-F, for either a replacement, or Refund....all you need to do is ASK.

 

Not just tools, but most things, I buy based on value to me. I’ll never buy a Caddie, because a Chevy does what I need, Im not trying to impress anyone.

Many times that cheaper thing just needs a bit of modification to do the job well - I like to tinker and pay myself this way.

I have quite few HF tools - most only used occasionally, cheap enough that if it does break I buy a better gizmo. I have sets of their mechanics end wrenches and sockets that have been used constantly for 30 years - 1 has broken.

 

I have sets of their mechanics end wrenches and sockets that have been used constantly for 30 years - 1 has broken.

Their wrenches and sockets are guaranteed for life, so you can take it back for a free replacement. Can't beat that for the price!

Cheers,
Brad

 

It doesn’t surprise me that Horrible fraud has a great return policy.
Makes sense

 

There is a trickle down effect in manufactured goods. At a given price point, quality tends to be better than it was in years past (passed?).

 

Good advice for both those starting out and those that have been in it for a while. I would also mention the value of used tools. It’s been true for me that decent used tools are often the same price or cheaper than their current junky counter parts. I have many older tools that are Craftsman and made in America. I know a lot of folks look down their nose at them but they seemed to have made great quality home owner grade equipment vs anything made now days in comparison. A $150 craftsman 113 tablesaw will saw rings around anything on the market for $500 or less now. Honestly I’ve probably spent just a few thousand on all my tools but since most were used you’d probably have to spend 3x that much if you tried to get their current replacement counterparts and still the quality would be lacking

 

I would also mention the value of used tools. It’s been true for me that decent used tools are often the same price or cheaper than their current junky counter parts.
[...]
Honestly I’ve probably spent just a few thousand on all my tools but since most were used you’d probably have to spend 3x that much if you tried to get their current replacement counterparts and still the quality would be lacking

I fully agree that buying used gets you the most bang for the buck - however, there is a big difference between buying something cheap and something built cheap (and usually the later implies the former). For example, I bought a Unisaw for $250, which is cheap... but I certainly wouldn't call it a cheap tool

Cheers,
Brad

 

I'm always amused at the woodworkers whose egos are stroked more by the tools they have than the finished goods they produce.



But at least for the hobbyist among us, it's all about enjoyment of the craft. For some it's the joy of using a precision well tuned piece of machinery. For others is the joy of producing an impressive result with only the most basic of tools. But don't anyone look down on another craftsman because their shop is smaller or outfitted with less expensive equipment. Have pity on those who don't enjoy their time in the shop.

 

When I began my WW journey, I bought mostly gently used power tools from Craig's List at no more than 50% retail.
Over the years, I determined I didn't really need or even like joiners, planners, mortisers, etc. I sold that stuff back on Craig's List at fair prices. Now I'm very happy with a quality table saw, band saw, floor drill press and totally in love with a 19" drum sander. A couple other things I learned was that wood milling is not as much fun as it looks especially when you get older and justifying expensive equipment because your heirs will "cherish" them could be fallacy. My advice is determine which woods you enjoy working with and keep some on hand. (while protecting them and your eyes and your ears)

 

I have found is that inexpensive will work for a lot of tools that are not going to be used excessively (they aren't made for that). However, if there is one tool that I would not recommend in cheap or inexpensive it would be hand planes. They are wonderful tools but if you go cheap, in most cases you will end up with something that makes you talk ugly and drink more bourbon.

 

Yeah...right..

Stanley No. 8c, made just after WW2...$70....jointing an Ash board for a glue up

Works just fine...

Montgomery War's Master Quality (Stanley) No. 78...$25counting shipping from FeeBay..

Millers Falls No. 11, Type 2 ( Pre-WW2) Junior Jack plane...I think I paid $10 for it...

Go and buy the new versions, and get back to me...I'll be using the lumber bought with the money I saved...

 

Dear tool, does not mean good
Cheap, does not mean bad.
Carefully familiarize yourself with the characteristics and do not rape it .... a bicycle car (trailer) will not replace the truck. The chisel cannot chop 1-2 cm, this is not an ax.
It's my personal opinion.

 

You can bash pretty much any brand tool out there, even Festool. Cheap may be cheap, but cost effective is saving cash. And high end brands, aren't necessarily cost effective. I live only six blocks from Harbor Freight. So it's simple to stop in anytime to compare what they have to offer compared to others. HF has many good tools. Some HF tools work the same if not better then the high end brands. I'm frugal, so I do try to compare the different tools for best value. Example; HF Detail Sanders went on sale for $9.95 with coupon. So I bought six of them. I put a different grit sandpaper on four of them and two are still in the box. If one does go bad I'm not out. You can't do this with a $75 detail sander.

I think one should buy the tool they need that's cost effect, without being choosy on brand. I started doing woodworking on a regular basis six years ago when I retired. Not all of us has deep pockets. But I'm able to get the tools I need for the project on hand. If your pocket book is unlimited, then go ahead and buy tools like the Festool brand. Personally, I won't buy Festool. But that's a personal choice. Why should I pay 10 times the amount for a tool that does the same job. Most of us have tools that only get used maybe once or twice in a five year period. So those tools you may have questioned yourself, why did I buy them? Same as the tools you bought "would be nice to have" and not used yet & collecting dust. We all have tools, we may need someday. But will we ever use them. All these tools are considered a cash drain.

 

Well said.

 

The price of tools does not remain constant. I bought my first Swiss-Made (Pfeil) carving gouge in 2001. It cost $21. The same gouge today is listed at $42 - exactly double. That first gouge was actually the most expensive because I bought it at a shop in Brienz, Switzerland. It was expensive to get there. LOL

 

I have an opposite version of that story...

When Hitachi first came out with the "C8" sliding chopsaw, I was skeptical of it. I was thinking it probably won't hold up, etc... as I remember, it was about $400+ back in the eighties.

After years of seeing that saw become the industry standard of chopsaws, I broke down and bought one in 1992. The price had gone up to about $650 by then...

About five or six years ago, the old Hitachi made it's last cut. It needed more than just brushes... maybe bearings, I dunno...

Anyways, here's the good part of the story. I bought the new Hitachi version of that same saw, and it was only about $350 on sale... It's not exactly the same, but it works just as good and it weighs less than the old one.

 

I think this may be a common senario.I bought a 29 piece fractional twist drill set many years ago and maybe half the drill bits have ever been used. The 1/16" bit is most often missing. Same with number size sets with the numbers 50-60 missing and most never used. I now only buy bits when I need them. Most common sizes used are 1/8",1/4',5/16"and 3/8". Woodworkers usually use a small number of drill sizes while metalworkers usually have a need for the less common sizes. This may not be true for all hobbyists, but is typical for me.

 

Absolutely! I don't even like having too many different sized bits, and I like to keep extras of every size smaller than 3/16"

I always buy cobalt bits because they're worth it. Even the little replacement spares. They cost more but, they last so long, I would say they're actually cheaper in the long run. And they can make the critical cuts that regular bits just can't do. Like in stainless steel, or extracting broken screws, etc...

There was a cool part in an old book that I read a long time ago. I forget the title, it might've been called "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance"?... Anyways, the story was about a pilot who would fly into deep wilderness and his opinion of quality tools went something like this: ~usually a cheap wrench will work just fine, but if that wrench breaks when you're using it... it becomes a whole different scenario.

 

Re: WoodenDreams; I recall a building contractor who bought HF tools for a special application. If only used that one time and fell apart, it was OK and tax dedudtible as an expense. He also said he has HF tools that have given good service. I bought the red handle turning tool set when I started years ago. I keep them sharp with the low speed grinder and touch them up as needed. They cost as much as one name brand tool. Also, I bought the HF rechargeable screwdriver for ten bucks. Same one at the big box store was $30. The HF one has lasted several years and has loads of torque.

 

If you value premium tools and have the funds, buy the best. But be careful to assume an attitude that “Only the best will do”.

I love quality tools as much as anyone, and own my share of “premium” tools, but noy for the sake of owning them, just because I enjoy using them.

Sometimes a cheap tool can be made decent. I remember watching Frank Klausz make a $16 gents saw into a fine dovetailing saw, and I’ve repeated the process just to prove it to myself. That said, I reach for my LN when I’m doing dovetails.

Every ww’ing hand tool I’ve seen at HF is a joke, period. That doesn’t mean after x hours if fettling I couldn’t produce a better dovetail with a hacksaw and HF chisel than $400 worth of premium tools. 😁

 

Hard to reason with.....a closed mind....

$10 Junior Jack plane vs Ash...

Plane was sold by Van Camp, and is marked as such

3" x 21" belt sander...from Harbor Freight....been in use for at least the past year.

Still in HARD use....BTW...