Journals Projects Workshops Reviews

I hope that's a strong joint

4029 Views 29 Replies 17 Participants Last post by Mahdeew, Oct 16, 2014

johnhutchinson

Discussion Starter · Oct 8, 2014 (Edited by Moderator)

2

I just saw this mid-century-modern chair in the Modernica blog …

http://blog.modernica.net/weekend-los-angeles-modern-auction/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=weekend-los-angeles-modern-auction

To me, the bottom leg joint looks like a lawsuit waiting to happen. I'm now wondering if it ever went into production. I have a Heywood Wakefield lounge chair with a similar joint where the arms meet the legs, but NOT where the legs meet the sleds.

I'm calling it a Dirty Harry (Feelin' lucky, punk?) joint. Your thoughts?

Furniture Chair Comfort Wood Armrest

See less See more

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

a1Jim

· #2 · Oct 8, 2014

A very cool design .I really can't see what kind of joint was used ,but it does take lot's of stress for sure.

Mahdeew

· #3 · Oct 8, 2014

Holy crap! Just looking at it makes you want to find an alternative seating area.

johnhutchinson

Discussion Starter · #4 · Oct 8, 2014

Jim: I'm betting that dowels were used in the joint … VERY STRONG DOWELS. That seems to be the joinery-of-choice for the period.

mrjinx007: Are you saying that you wouldn't want to flop into that good 'ol recliner?

stefang

· #5 · Oct 8, 2014

This looks like a pretty strong construction to me John. The bottom rail on the arm reinforces the joint on the top of the arm and I'm pretty sure the seat must be constructed to provide the backwards or rocking motion. Another clue to it's solid construction is it's age, which looks to be at least 30 or 40 years old or possibly more.

I had some leather chairs with a very similar look to it, but made with continuous bent laminated beech with no joints in the arms. I bought them in the 80's and my son is still using them in his basement. They are 'springy' and comfortable.

johnhutchinson

Discussion Starter · #6 · Oct 8, 2014

2

Mike: Good point on the age, but I wonder if the 'sitters' lived that long.

Mies Van Der Rohe did a similar chair, but he decided that steel was a better way to go.

Furniture Comfort Rectangle Chair Armrest

See less See more

Mahdeew

· #7 · Oct 8, 2014

I have 240 pound (mostly muscles) friend sit in one of those 60's made metal pipe chairs and he stared to rock on it and next thing you know, he was doing backward flips in my garden behind him. Likely, he didn't suffer any injuries. I think this design is more likely to fail at the bottom rather the top rails. Looking at the wight distribution, the pressure would want to tear that bottom joint apart. Yea, dowels would definitely prevent that tear out-not.

screwikea

· #8 · Oct 8, 2014

Hey stefangm I think you missed what he's talking about-there's basically a butt joint coming into the part of the legs on the floor. So there are some fasteners or something happening in there, but it's a WHOLE lot of shear force getting thrown into the butt joints. Like with what mrjinx007 pointed out, if you get someone leaning back into the chair hard enough they'll pop the joint.

This looks like a pretty strong construction to me John. The bottom rail on the arm reinforces the joint on the top of the arm and I m pretty sure the seat must be constructed to provide the backwards or rocking motion. Another clue to it s solid construction is it s age, which looks to be at least 30 or 40 years old or possibly more.

bondogaposis

· #9 · Oct 8, 2014

Americans weren't as big back then.

jmartel

· #10 · Oct 8, 2014

It would be strongest to use a bridle or a half-lap joint on those. Dowels do little to add strength.

TheFridge

· #11 · Oct 8, 2014 (Edited by Moderator)

Veneered possibly?

I don't see a seam along the front at the top or bottom.

JAAune

· #12 · Oct 8, 2014

2

At first glance it looks like a weak dowel joint but a more careful examination indicates that there's a rim of bent wood going all the way around the leg. That curved piece looks about a quarter inch thick or so and may either be steam bent or laminated but probably the latter.

Rectangle Wood Wood stain Font Parallel

What that outer lamination accomplishes is eliminating the pulling force on the joint between the foot and the leg. Instead of wanting to pull apart, it's forcing that joint into compression and all the pulling force is directed at the seamless piece of bent wood. A dowel joint can withstand compressive force with ease.

See less See more

AlaskaGuy

· #13 · Oct 8, 2014

Could be something like in this video.

johnhutchinson

Discussion Starter · #14 · Oct 8, 2014

AlaskaGuy: Thanks for the Thomas Moser link. He's been a hero of mine since Day One !!!
I think he defines modern American furniture.

intelligen

· #15 · Oct 8, 2014

WOOD Magazine's ZigZag chair elicited similar concerns, so they tested their joint.

Mahdeew

· #16 · Oct 8, 2014

Rob, that was amazing. Hard to believe that piece held up under that much pressure. JAAune, 1/2" bent oak wood would have somewhere around 5000 lb of shearing resistance. Not sure how many pounds that would translate into with let say a 200lb person fully seated on that chair.

johnhutchinson

Discussion Starter · #17 · Oct 8, 2014

Jacob (aka JAAune): I'm nominating you for the Columbo Prize For Woodworking Investigation.
I think you nailed it with the bent laminations. There IS more to the joint than first meets the eye.

PS - Keep your laser warm. Incoming soon.

Yonak

· #18 · Oct 8, 2014

I would think a lag bolt, screwed up from the bottom, would help immensely.

Loren

· #19 · Oct 8, 2014

Great eye, JAAune. It makes sense. Otherwise it would
have this end-grain thing going on. I'll bet the designer
was after a way to solve the end grain issue and the
strength is an added byproduct. I have seen this sort
of chair joint done with exposed end grain too. I figured
it was done with mortise and tenon.

I look at a lot of chairs.

JAAune

· #20 · Oct 8, 2014

Could be a mortise and tenon in there but for some reason I'm thinking it's a commercially produced chair so that's why I'm guessing dowels. We'll never know unless someone wants to go buy it and take it apart for everybody's benefit.

@JohnHutchinson,

Laser is ready to go as always.

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.