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View chef57's profile

Crosscut with new freud blade

by chef57
posted 02-05-2017 04:12 PM


33 replies so far

View Jack Lewis's profile

Jack Lewis

442 posts in 1474 days


#1 posted 02-05-2017 05:08 PM

I use those blades for segmented bowl cutting. Get glue-up ready cuts both sides. The only difference I can see if the riff knife is removed from my saw for cross cuts. Just a suggestion.
An after thought, check the run-out of saw arbor and/or squareness to miter track.

-- "PLUMBER'S BUTT! Get over it, everybody has one"

View Madmark2's profile

Madmark2

465 posts in 984 days


#2 posted 02-05-2017 05:33 PM

That doesn’t look like a new blade – too much paint scraped. My guess is that either the blade is flanged (warped, lay on known flat surface to check) or that the miter gauge is off.

M

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

8290 posts in 3771 days


#3 posted 02-05-2017 05:44 PM

Make sure the arbor nut isn’t too tight….should only be snug, not deforming the blade.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View Rich's profile

Rich

4494 posts in 985 days


#4 posted 02-05-2017 05:49 PM

Since your DeWalt blade didn’t do that, it must be a problem with the Freud blade.

-- Knowledge is not skill. Knowledge plus ten thousand times is skill. -- Shinichi Suzuki

View coxhaus's profile

coxhaus

119 posts in 1290 days


#5 posted 02-05-2017 06:12 PM

I had a problem with my old Delta contractor saw where the table was out of adjustment and when a piece of wood passed over the back of the blade the carbide on a couple of teeth would hit one side and etch it. Can the carbides be bigger on the new blade to where they hit and the old ones did not?

I run a Unisaw now in great alignment with a Freud crosscut blade with no problems and 2 smooth sides on the wood after a cut.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12817 posts in 2775 days


#6 posted 02-05-2017 06:35 PM

Why is your new blade scratched up like an old blade? Take it back and exchange it.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View chef57's profile

chef57

17 posts in 874 days


#7 posted 02-05-2017 06:51 PM

Thank you all for the information. The blade was brand new out of the package 4 days ago. When I put the blade on I cut a piece of scrap wood about 1-1/2 wide by 1-1/2 wide by 6 inches long. I used my miter gauge and made 2 cuts, both came off rough on the right side. This morning I cut about 10 pieces of cedar 1/2×3 x 15 inches. I cut it into approximately 3 inch blocks for our closets. Again just the right side was rough.

By the way I tried it with the riving in place and not in place, same result.

As far as the wear goes before I cut anything else I cut through a zero clearance insert with that blade, that’s the only place the wear could have come from.

I’m stepping out but I’ll try the other suggestions and check the blade for flatness later today or tomorrow morning.

For what it’s worth I also have a brand new Freud glue line rip blade and it cuts beautifully. The lines come out so smooth on both sides.

I’m starting to think there might be a problem with that blade since the glue line blade as well as my old dewalt blades all cut just fine.

View William Shelley's profile

William Shelley

609 posts in 1865 days


#8 posted 02-05-2017 06:57 PM

I would take it back to the store.

The store probably got scammed. I worked at Home Depot for a number of years and I saw multiple occasions of people buying a sawblade, taking it home and then putting their old one in the package, and returning it. Many times the cashier has no idea what a 4 year old sawblade looks like.

-- Woodworking from an engineer's perspective

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

8290 posts in 3771 days


#9 posted 02-05-2017 08:31 PM

I’d exchange it. The LU88 is a really nice blade….it should give better results than what you’re getting.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View oldnovice's profile

oldnovice

7487 posts in 3763 days


#10 posted 02-05-2017 08:55 PM

Never seen results like that before because I only use Forrest saw blades; not cheap but very nice results!

-- "I never met a board I didn't like!"

View Redoak49's profile

Redoak49

4007 posts in 2384 days


#11 posted 02-05-2017 08:56 PM

I use that model blade also and get good cuts.

I would examine the teeth closely and make certain none are damaged. With ATB and Hi ATB, the tips can be damaged.

I would also check that the blade is parallel to the miter slots and miter gauge is perpendicular to the blade. This is a good check to do routinely on a table saw.

If you feel like doing another check, you could also check and see if the teeth are all the same. You could mount a dial indicator with a magnetic base on your table saw and measure the relative difference in the teeth. You would measure every other tooth on the right side.

Or you could skip all of this and return the blade.

View chef57's profile

chef57

17 posts in 874 days


#12 posted 02-05-2017 09:08 PM

I’ve squared my table to my blade, it’s .001. From front to back on the right side my dewalt crosscut 60 tooth blade is about .002. This blade was .004 from front to back on the same tooth. Still we’re talking about 4 thousandths of an inch. It’s hard to believe that is what’s causing the results. At any rate it’s going back and I’m getting a replacement.

Again thank you all very much. It’s nice to have a place to turn when you need help.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12817 posts in 2775 days


#13 posted 02-05-2017 09:51 PM

Yeah I think somewhere along the line someone switched a used blade for a new one. I have the exact same blade, mine is years old and looks better than yours.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Matt Rogers's profile

Matt Rogers

110 posts in 2365 days


#14 posted 02-05-2017 10:24 PM

I would guess that the sled/miter gauge/fence is not parallel to the blade. This would cause one side to get cut on the the teeth on the front of the blade and then track clear of the teeth on the rear. The other side would track into the rear teeth and get an extra raking cut from those teeth. If you can cut a piece of hardwood that will not tear out, you may see the saw marks on one of the pieces going all //// and the marks on the other either \\\\ or /\/\/\/ from the blade cutting on the down stroke in the front or on the upstroke in the rear.

Hope that made any sense.

-- Matt Rogers, http://www.cleanairwoodworks.com and http://www.cleanairyurts.com

View ArtMann's profile

ArtMann

1386 posts in 1211 days


#15 posted 02-06-2017 02:01 AM

I have seen the problem many times. Matt has already nailed it. The blade is almost certainly not parallel to the miter slots. If you do a careful alignment, the problem will go away. The chances of a defective blade causing the problem are very low.

View Rich's profile

Rich

4494 posts in 985 days


#16 posted 02-06-2017 04:38 AM

I generally keep my mouth shut unless I have something positive to say. I’m mind-boggled on this thread though. Did anyone read the OP’s message? It said the DeWalt blade cut cleanly, but the Freud didn’t. Later, he said another Freud blade cut cleanly. What should that tell you? Hint: it’s the blade.

Has anyone read the intervening posts? Obviously not.

Why are the “alignment must be off” posts going on? Go back to post #4. I said — the DeWalt blade cut cleanly, so it must be the Freud blade.

Q.E.D.

-- Knowledge is not skill. Knowledge plus ten thousand times is skill. -- Shinichi Suzuki

View builtinbkyn's profile

builtinbkyn

2939 posts in 1336 days


#17 posted 02-06-2017 04:47 AM

I recently purchased a Freud Premier Fusion 40T and have the same issue. I have yet to contact them regarding this, but it’s not my saw unless it is exceeding the 7000RPMs printed on the blade. My saw is dialed in. I checked it after seeing how the blade was getting after only a few cuts. Very disappointed in this blade.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn & Steel City :)

View TheFridge's profile

TheFridge

10858 posts in 1881 days


#18 posted 02-06-2017 06:00 AM

I figured it would make identically bad cuts on both sides of the blade. Not just one.

Package was unopened right?

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

View Redoak49's profile

Redoak49

4007 posts in 2384 days


#19 posted 02-06-2017 12:10 PM

Yes, I have read the entire thread. It is worthwhile checking alignment and the miter gauge anytime there is an issue like this.

If it were me, I would want to take all the time to figure out what is wrong with the blade. It would be worthwhile to know and share the info.

Just as a note, I recently purchase the Freud Premier Fusion blade and love it. I bought it for about $60 and could not pass it up. It is a very clean cutting blade in Wood and plywood…perfect cuts and no splinters. I will comment that on some woods which have a tendency to burn, you will need to watch it. The blade has a pretty high ATB with tight side clearance. This gives you a good cut but increases to tendency to burn.

View Woodbum's profile

Woodbum

874 posts in 3461 days


#20 posted 02-06-2017 12:40 PM

Per Occam’s Razor theory: The simplest answer is often the correct one. Too many assumptions just muddy up the issue. Return the blade and get one that is right. You should get what you paid for; and that blade normally performs much better than the results that you are experiencing. JMHO.

-- "Now I'm just another old guy wearing funny clothes"

View Robert's profile

Robert

3405 posts in 1876 days


#21 posted 02-06-2017 03:28 PM

I personally don’t find that much tear out unacceptable. You may want to consider 80T for better results.

Here are a few things to check:

Your machine:

1. Blade alignment. Be sure xcut fence is perfect 90° to blade. This is the most common cause of tear out.
2. Blade height. Generally you want no more than the bottom of the gullet exposed. This keep the angle of attack slightly more parallel to surface.
3. Check arbor for run out.
4. Stabilizer washers especially if using a thin kerf blade.
5. Zero clearance insert. You may find starting with a fresh one will help.

Technique:

1. Be sure wood is stable through the cut by use of a stop block or clamping wood to fence.
2. Use a backer board.
3. Last but not least, score cut lines on all 4 sides of board, make the cut strong, then use a shooting board and hand plane to finalize the cut. I do this all the time when I need a perfect cut.

Keep in mind some woods (especially plywood) will be more prone to tear out than others. In these cases I use the scoring technique.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

View JRsgarage's profile

JRsgarage

367 posts in 905 days


#22 posted 02-06-2017 03:54 PM

i think the op isolated the issue to the new blade. he’s not experiencing the flawed cuts with his other blades as mentioned by few. possibly a slight warpage in blade which explains the excessive paint wear in certain areas

-- “Facts don't care about your feelings.” ..., Ben Shapiro

View coxhaus's profile

coxhaus

119 posts in 1290 days


#23 posted 02-06-2017 11:09 PM

What is the table saw? If it is a cabinet saw then I bet it can be adjusted better. I figured it out when I switched from a contractor saw to a Unisaw. The Unisaw can really be fine tuned compared to my old contractor saw.

View ArtMann's profile

ArtMann

1386 posts in 1211 days


#24 posted 02-06-2017 11:33 PM

Go ahead and get the blade exchanged. If it doesn’t work any better, remember what I said above. I have seen this problem a lot of times and I have yet to see a defective blade as the root cause. I think what is happening is that the clean cut is happening during the down direction of the blade and the rough cut is happening as the rear teeth contact the wood in the up direction.

View chef57's profile

chef57

17 posts in 874 days


#25 posted 02-07-2017 11:45 PM

Once again thank you all for your help. The old blade is on its way back to Amazon. The replacement blade arrived today. I put it on the saw and it cuts flawlessly, problem solved, it was the blade.

View mrbob's profile

mrbob

182 posts in 964 days


#26 posted 02-08-2017 12:09 AM



Once again thank you all for your help. The old blade is on its way back to Amazon. The replacement blade arrived today. I put it on the saw and it cuts flawlessly, problem solved, it was the blade.

- chef57

That was my thoughts, opinion and a Freud blade man.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12817 posts in 2775 days


#27 posted 02-08-2017 12:28 AM

Good to hear

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Tony_S's profile

Tony_S

971 posts in 3478 days


#28 posted 02-08-2017 12:32 AM



I generally keep my mouth shut unless I have something positive to say. I m mind-boggled on this thread though. Did anyone read the OP s message? It said the DeWalt blade cut cleanly, but the Freud didn t. Later, he said another Freud blade cut cleanly. What should that tell you? Hint: it s the blade.

Has anyone read the intervening posts? Obviously not.
- RichTaylor

You’re still pretty new here….get used to it.

-- It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. Aristotle

View ArtMann's profile

ArtMann

1386 posts in 1211 days


#29 posted 02-08-2017 01:08 AM

Blades are not all the same. Whether the wor-kpiece is erroneously cut on the up stroke depends on the thickness of the plate, the thickness of the kerf and the geometry of the teeth and even how firmly you secure the work-piece. The fact that some other blade worked better is not definitive proof of root cause by itself.

I read the original post and I know what the evidence is implying. I’m just saying that it is quite possibly misleading and the OP is going to have to try some other thing if blade replacement doesn’t work. I have been at this for 40+ years and used more saws than I can remember. After a while, when I see or fix the same problem over and over again, the most likely solution becomes obvious.

View Rich's profile

Rich

4494 posts in 985 days


#30 posted 02-08-2017 04:08 AM

You re still pretty new here….get used to it.

- Tony_S

I know. It will continue too, as is evidenced by the previous post. It’s fun getting to know the players though. I like it here.

Different strokes for different folks.

-- Knowledge is not skill. Knowledge plus ten thousand times is skill. -- Shinichi Suzuki

View Rich's profile

Rich

4494 posts in 985 days


#31 posted 02-08-2017 04:48 AM


I m just saying that it is quite possibly misleading and the OP is going to have to try some other thing if blade replacement doesn t work.

- ArtMann


Once again thank you all for your help. The old blade is on its way back to Amazon. The replacement blade arrived today. I put it on the saw and it cuts flawlessly, problem solved, it was the blade.

- chef57

Time to put this baby to bed. :)

-- Knowledge is not skill. Knowledge plus ten thousand times is skill. -- Shinichi Suzuki

View chef57's profile

chef57

17 posts in 874 days


#32 posted 04-12-2017 11:17 AM



Hi all, I am new to woodworking and I have just installed a new
freud crosscut blade on my tablesaw. The crosscuts are coming out with one very smooth side one very rough side. The piece of wood on the left side of the blade is as smooth as can be but the piece that comes off the right side of the blade is as rough as can be. My dewalt crosscut blade didn t do that. Does anyone have any idea what might be causing this?

By the way I ve tried the same cut with and without a zero clearancee insert, with and without a blade stabilizer, and with the miter gauge in both slots. No matter what I change I get the same exact results.

If the definition of insanity is doing the same thing again and again and expecting different results what is doing different things over and getting the same result? :-|

- chef57

So for everyone that replied, I fugured out what caused the problem. Apparently when I installed the zero clearance insert, and cut up through it, the insert warped the blade. I don’t understand how but it did.

Once the new crosscut blade was installed and pushed up through the insert it somehow didn’t warp, so the cross cuts have been fine.

I discovered this the other day when I put my crosscut blade back on the saw.

I really want to understand why the blade didn’t cut straight up through the insert, but instead warped to the right, as you are facing the saw.

View Jack Lewis's profile

Jack Lewis

442 posts in 1474 days


#33 posted 04-12-2017 03:31 PM

Has to be a bad blade because the Dewalt blade is fine!

-- "PLUMBER'S BUTT! Get over it, everybody has one"

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