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View ttocsmi's profile

Anyone Build Stairs?

by ttocsmi
posted 09-07-2016 10:55 AM


20 replies so far

View Snipes's profile

Snipes

438 posts in 2786 days


#1 posted 09-07-2016 01:54 PM

Tony s is the man you want to talk to.

-- if it is to be it is up to me

View dbray45's profile

dbray45

3320 posts in 3318 days


#2 posted 09-07-2016 02:02 PM

You really want to put this on paper. If you are replacing the entire case, a structural engineer needs to look at it first. There is nothing worse than building a staircase built and have it flex when 2 or 3 people are on it.

-- David in Damascus, MD

View Snipes's profile

Snipes

438 posts in 2786 days


#3 posted 09-07-2016 02:20 PM

fasten your stringers to 3\4” ply (green treated if going to block) and red heads and glue to block. Glue top riser. Don’t forget to subtract for plywood.

-- if it is to be it is up to me

View ttocsmi's profile

ttocsmi

42 posts in 1930 days


#4 posted 09-07-2016 02:27 PM

fasten your stringers to 3/4” ply (green treated if going to block) and red heads and glue to block. Glue top riser. Don t forget to subtract for plywood.

any reason to use redheads/wedges vs masonry screws? it seems like you’d need to be very careful selecting the right length redhead due to the void inside the cinder blocks.

thoughts on sub-treads vs attaching hardwood treads directly to stringers?

also: the stairs will be half height (6 risers) & built with 3 2×12 stringers.

-- Knight of Sufferlandria 2015

View Snipes's profile

Snipes

438 posts in 2786 days


#5 posted 09-07-2016 02:41 PM

Strength, screws be fine also, just make sure there heavy duty. Sounds like you know what your doing. what’s the width? I would probably use solid, but i think both would be fine. just have to shorten your bottom riser accordingly, right?

-- if it is to be it is up to me

View mike02130's profile

mike02130

170 posts in 1214 days


#6 posted 09-07-2016 02:53 PM

Snipes gave you good information. My question is why do you question him? I’m a finish carpenter and stair builder. I’ve never heard of a sub tread?

I’m assuming the poplar is for the risers and oak/fir for the treads? Do yourself a favor and dado the risers and rabbet the treads. Gives it strength and makes it easier. Use construction adhesive for the treads and have shim material.

What about Newell’s, balusters and handrail and skirt boards?

You can call it what you want but it is a carpentry project. You are dealing with level and plumb and most likely out of square conditions.

No engineer and forget the book, it’ll give you too many options.

To answer your question questioning Snipe’s advice, it’s about shear strength.

-- Google first, search forums second, ask questions later.

View pintodeluxe's profile

pintodeluxe

6002 posts in 3355 days


#7 posted 09-07-2016 03:01 PM

Build the stairs straight, or with 90 degree turns. I trimmed a staircase that had two 45 degree landings, and it was a real pain as everything becomes a compound angle.

Another thing I would recommend… build the stairs with the trim in mind. Start thinking about your finish millwork from day one.

-- Willie, Washington "If You Choose Not To Decide, You Still Have Made a Choice" - Rush

View ttocsmi's profile

ttocsmi

42 posts in 1930 days


#8 posted 09-07-2016 03:12 PM

thanks for all the feedback.

looks like 1/4” Confast screws should suffice.

i’ve seen stairs built with sub-risers/sub-treads, no sub- material, bottom-dadoed treads, back-rabbeted treads, dadoed/wedged/glued stringers, glue blocks, and hardwood overlays. there are as many ways of building stairs as there are of building a table.

painted poplar risers & skirts, oak treads, fir stringers. single open return.

haven’t gotten to the newel or railing yet. newel will be cut into or sit atop the bottom step.

I just need to find the time to do all the math…

-- Knight of Sufferlandria 2015

View josephf's profile

josephf

217 posts in 2638 days


#9 posted 09-08-2016 03:14 AM

The part that gets me is newel post and railing placement .getting all the details right ahead of time for a good railing flow . I will add something i have been doing .generally if at all possible i have been using pocket screws ,as much as i can .
your stringers -you said fir .figure your talking 2×12 ,i gang them together and run a planer over the top edge so that i have a sharp edge when i am marking for cuts and also so the surface of all 3[or how many] is exact . i love getting to use LVL ,straight ,wider ,sharp edge and great surface for pencil lines . the concrete blocks your attaching to probable will be better as you sujested with screws .wonder if you should put a little construction on the mating surface .should make it permanent .

View jwmalone's profile

jwmalone

769 posts in 1244 days


#10 posted 09-08-2016 03:27 AM

With all due respect, they don’t call them master carpenters for nothing. Seen a few master carpenters build spiral and other stair cases in multi million dollar homes in the best neighborhoods in the south east. Point I’m making is don’t cheat yourself out of some valuable knowledge.

-- "Boy you could get more work done it you quit flapping your pie hole" Grandpa

View ttocsmi's profile

ttocsmi

42 posts in 1930 days


#11 posted 09-08-2016 11:56 AM

your stringers -you said fir .figure your talking 2×12 ,i gang them together and run a planer over the top edge so that i have a sharp edge when i am marking for cuts and also so the surface of all 3[or how many] is exact .

ahh, that’s a good idea. although, my planer is only 12” – how do I get the stringer to fit? :P

mine will not be a master carpentry job – by any means – no matter how much my wife blurs her eyes when looking at it. as long as it looks nice & doesn’t creak, i’ll be good.

I think the existing stairs are the originals from 1971. depending on how this project turns out (ie the overall PITA value), I may also rebuild the 1/2 stairs from the main floor to the upper level.

-- Knight of Sufferlandria 2015

View mike02130's profile

mike02130

170 posts in 1214 days


#12 posted 09-08-2016 12:57 PM

I think josephf is referring to a hand held power planer?

-- Google first, search forums second, ask questions later.

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

8399 posts in 3340 days


#13 posted 09-08-2016 02:08 PM



Tony s is the man you want to talk to.

- Snipes

Tony doesn’t build stairs. Tony builds STAIRS!

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View GR8HUNTER's profile

GR8HUNTER

6597 posts in 1254 days


#14 posted 09-08-2016 02:16 PM

NO I DONT …..... LMAO

-- Tony---- Reinholds,Pa.------ REMEMBER TO ALWAYS HAVE FUN

View josephf's profile

josephf

217 posts in 2638 days


#15 posted 09-08-2016 02:17 PM

yes -hand held planer .top edge of all stringers at one time clamp or screw them together and plane top edge .

View ttocsmi's profile

ttocsmi

42 posts in 1930 days


#16 posted 09-08-2016 02:27 PM

thanks, josephf. 2/10 on my attempt at humor.

-- Knight of Sufferlandria 2015

View Snipes's profile

Snipes

438 posts in 2786 days


#17 posted 09-08-2016 03:18 PM

Tony doesn’t build stairs. Tony builds STAIRS!

I concur!!

-- if it is to be it is up to me

View Tony_S's profile

Tony_S

1029 posts in 3625 days


#18 posted 09-09-2016 10:20 AM

Late comer to the party….

Concrete screws would be fine for a stair this small….that is, after I remove my unfounded bias towards both concrete screws and cinder block. I’ve never trusted or liked either.
If I was doing it, I’d use a construction adhesive as well(PL Premium).

As for the ‘sub tread’...or not.
There’s no actual need for it at all providing your solid tread is sound, and a minimum of 1” thick, with apropriate stringer support.
What your calling a sub tread would most typically just be a standard plywood (or in some cases OSB) tread on an actual staircase. Some builders don’t want a ‘finished grade’ hardwood product in place that trades will be running up and down for weeks on end….so they put a plywood stair in place, and clad it at a later date.
I assume that won’t be a concern to you, so just use the actual hardwood tread and plywood(or hardwood) riser for your initial build. No need for a ‘sub’ anything.

You’ve also been given some good advice in regards to consideration of both trim work and rail design, prebuild.
It’s a common mistake made, even in the stair industry.

-- “Wise men speak because they have something to say; fools because they have to say something.” – Plato

View JIMMIEM's profile

JIMMIEM

45 posts in 1383 days


#19 posted 09-09-2016 11:58 AM

Don’t forget the building code for your stair and handrail.

View ttocsmi's profile

ttocsmi

42 posts in 1930 days


#20 posted 09-09-2016 12:10 PM

right. yup.

i’ll post pics once I get to work.

thanks again for the advice.

-- Knight of Sufferlandria 2015

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