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View SuperCubber's profile

Taming Squeeze-out

by SuperCubber
posted 08-05-2016 02:15 AM


23 replies so far

View nightguy's profile

nightguy

213 posts in 1020 days


#1 posted 08-05-2016 02:28 AM

A tich less glue and start wiping out at the get go. ease up on the clamping pressure snug is good enough, with a sharp object wrapped in the rag, good thing you are painting and not staining/finishing!!

View Mark Shymanski's profile

Mark Shymanski

5623 posts in 4071 days


#2 posted 08-05-2016 03:58 AM

Are you gluing the panels in?

-- "Checking for square? What madness is this! The cabinet is square because I will it to be so!" Jeremy Greiner LJ Topic#20953 2011 Feb 2

View JBrow's profile

JBrow

1368 posts in 1278 days


#3 posted 08-05-2016 04:14 AM

SuperCubber,

I am aware of the following strategies for dealing with glue squeeze out. If there is no squeeze out, my worry becomes whether I applied enough glue or clamping pressure to do the job.

1. Clean squeeze out immediately with a damp cloth. As you noted, the glue smears on the surrounding wood creating even a bigger mess. Therefore, I wipe the area multiple times with clean section of the rag until the glue appears to be completely removed. If the dampened rag is too wet, I suppose some water can seep into the joint and perhaps weaken the glue bond. Therefore when I use this method, I try to use a well rung rag. If all the glue is not completely removed from the surrounding surface, it can become an ugly surprise when finish is applied. I have used this method many times but these days I am using it less often.

2. Wait until the squeeze out has skimmed over and then remove with a cabinet scraper, paint scraper, and/or chisel. I have found that the longer I wait, the less active glue remains under the skimmed over glue layer. As a result, the mess is more easily contained. I find waiting several hours leaves the squeeze out fairly easily removed without much mess. Testing a small area can reveal when its time. I am using this method more often than I did in the past.

3. Wait until the glue has completely cured and then sand out squeeze out. I have occasionally found that if I put a scraper to the cured glue, I can remove some of the surrounding wood, so I steer clear of scrapping cured glue squeeze out. This method works well for me when the surfaces are flat and easy to access. Not so much on inside corners, although oftentimes a chisel can release the beads of squeeze out with much, if any, damage to surrounding wood. The problems I have observed with this method is that without enough sanding, some glue can remain that shows up when finishing. Sand too much and the dimension and shape of the joint can change. Nonetheless, this is method I tend to use when gluing a stile to a rail or a panel glue-up, since the joints usually required some flushing up.

4. Use painters tape at the joint lines and remove the painters tape when the glue is adequately skimmed over. I hardly ever use this method. It takes time to carefully and precisely apply the tape. The tape has to be firmly pressed in place otherwise some glue can get under the tape. If too much time passes before the tape is remove, the glue can grab the tape leaving both cured glue and tape surrounding the joint. Lastly, I fear that a little tape can find its way into the joint, spoiling the joint.

5. Pre-finish the wood surrounding the joint being careful to avoid areas where glue will be applied, allowing the finish to cure. Since glue seems to have some difficulty sticking to the slick finished surface that has cured, it can pop or wipe off the finished surfaces. I rarely use this method mainly because it interrupts my personal work flow. However, when gluing frame and panels, I pre-finish the panels to avoid unfinished areas from appearing at some future time. A side benefit to pre-finishing the panel is that any squeeze out that contacts the floating panel can be released without much hassle.

However you deal with squeeze out, I think it is a good idea to either raise the grain of the entire project with water just prior to sanding out to the last grit or apply clear mineral spirits during the sanding phase especially at the glued joints. Either method will reveal tall-tale glue left behind before the first coat of finish is applied and the glue then becomes much more difficult to remove.

View nightguy's profile

nightguy

213 posts in 1020 days


#4 posted 08-05-2016 04:27 AM

Hind sight thought, apply wax like Johnsons Paste Wax to the surrounding areas to the raw wood, then clean up the squeeze out, and then some MS or Naphtha to remove the wax, tape it off too works, but it can get under the tape. For regular yellow wood glue, if still moist, vinegar will cut it with some wiping out of raw wood pours .

View MadMark's profile

MadMark

979 posts in 1811 days


#5 posted 08-05-2016 04:39 AM

Less glue & razor the glue after 24hrs. As the wood dries the glue, the glue will shrink. The remainder just zips off with a razor scraper or blade. Trying to clean up as you glue just results in a misaligned mess. Dried drips also zip right off, but if you smear it you’re just going to spread it into an uncleanable mess.

Limit your glue and plan your assembly order so gravity works. Use a scrap of Lexan as a glue spreader instead of your finger. (If you use a finger as a spreader avoid the urge to taste the glue – trust me – it’s terrible! ). You want a thin, even, 100% coverage layer. Stories of starving a joint of glue when clamping are actually poor coverage issues. The clear lexan lets you see the glue as you spread for even thin layers.

Try gluing 1/2 a biscuit/dowel and letting it dry a bit before final gluing.

Thin your Elmers just a bit to get a little more work time. Have your clamps preset & ALWAYS dry fit before gluing.

M

-- Madmark - [email protected] Wiretreefarm.com

View SuperCubber's profile

SuperCubber

1073 posts in 2642 days


#6 posted 08-05-2016 05:16 AM



Are you gluing the panels in?

- Mark Shymanski

Yes, MDF panels.

JBrow, thanks for the detailed response. The pieces will be painted, so I’m not too worried about it spoiling a nice finish. I’m just trying to tame the mess as effectively and efficiently as possible. I will try the chisel after the glue has fully cured. Thanks for your advice and explanations. I really appreciate it.

MadMark, I will try the razor trick on the next one, along with the chisel. Thanks.

-- Joe | Spartanburg, SC | "To give anything less than your best is to sacrafice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine

View nightguy's profile

nightguy

213 posts in 1020 days


#7 posted 08-05-2016 06:02 AM


Are you gluing the panels in?

- Mark Shymanski

Yes, MDF panels.

JBrow, thanks for the detailed response. The pieces will be painted, so I m not too worried about it spoiling a nice finish. I m just trying to tame the mess as effectively and efficiently as possible. I will try the chisel after the glue has fully cured. Thanks for your advice and explanations. I really appreciate it.

MadMark, I will try the razor trick on the next one, along with the chisel. Thanks.

- SuperCubber

Razor blade/sharp chisel all the same, any sharp edge, scraper ect.

View GR8HUNTER's profile

GR8HUNTER

5956 posts in 1070 days


#8 posted 08-05-2016 03:08 PM

do not use some much clamp pressure …......as to squeeze out all of your glue …. lots of people make this mistake …... then wonder month down the road …......why did it fall apart ????

-- Tony---- Reinholds,Pa.------ REMEMBER TO ALWAYS HAVE FUN

View SuperCubber's profile

SuperCubber

1073 posts in 2642 days


#9 posted 08-05-2016 04:44 PM



do not use some much clamp pressure …......as to squeeze out all of your glue …. lots of people make this mistake …... then wonder month down the road …......why did it fall apart ????

- GR8HUNTER

First things first. The squeeze out is happening before I even apply the clamps. Second, I’m well aware of how much clamping pressure is enough. Third, there have been numerous tests showing that even when clamping edge joints, it’s almost impossible to starve the joint.

-- Joe | Spartanburg, SC | "To give anything less than your best is to sacrafice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine

View 000's profile

000

2859 posts in 1257 days


#10 posted 08-05-2016 05:00 PM

I’ve been wiping glue with a wet rag for years.
I keep a water bucket close by. Ring out rag, wipe as much as possible, rinse in bucket, ring out, repeat until mess is gone.
I often use a small slotted screwdriver/putty knife/pocket knife, whatever, covered with a portion of the rag to get into corners.
Anywhere you wipe it will raise the grain a little, and when staining, it will soak it the stain in more and make it darker so you always have to sand back to the same grit as the rest of the door.
I do understand your painting.

View SuperCubber's profile

SuperCubber

1073 posts in 2642 days


#11 posted 08-05-2016 05:14 PM

Thanks, jbay, I think not using a screwdriver or the like under the rag has been my downfall. I’ll give that a try.

-- Joe | Spartanburg, SC | "To give anything less than your best is to sacrafice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12771 posts in 2738 days


#12 posted 08-05-2016 05:16 PM

Use less glue, you only need a few dabs on the panels.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View KelleyCrafts's profile

KelleyCrafts

3701 posts in 1097 days


#13 posted 08-05-2016 05:42 PM


If you use a finger as a spreader avoid the urge to taste the glue – trust me – it s _terrible!

- MadMark

+1 – paint chips however, are yummy.

-- Dave - http://kelleycrafts.com/ - pen blanks - knife scales - turning tools

View SuperCubber's profile

SuperCubber

1073 posts in 2642 days


#14 posted 08-05-2016 06:14 PM



Use less glue, you only need a few dabs on the panels.

- Rick M.

I’ll try that, Rick. Thanks.

-- Joe | Spartanburg, SC | "To give anything less than your best is to sacrafice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine

View skatefriday's profile

skatefriday

452 posts in 1841 days


#15 posted 08-05-2016 06:18 PM


Thin your Elmers just a bit to get a little more work time. Have your clamps preset & ALWAYS dry fit before gluing.

M

- MadMark

I always look at glueups as 5 minutes of terror because of how quickly the Titebond 2 I use
grabs the joints.

They say it is supposed to have a 15 minute open time, but I get maybe 1 minute before it’s
grabbing, and 3 minutes before I have to break the bond with a hammer to get to move. I’d
love some more workable time to ensure everything is square.

View splintergroup's profile

splintergroup

2634 posts in 1580 days


#16 posted 08-05-2016 08:01 PM

I’m a big fan of Waxlit, which is a wax rubbed onto the wood. It works better that Johnsons wax, but it is getting difficult to find. A small 8 oz. can will last a lifetime.
Basically you dry-assemble the joint, smear a light coat of the wax, then do your glue-up. After the glue has dried, any squeeze out will pop right off. Mineral spirits can then be used to wipe of the wax film.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12771 posts in 2738 days


#17 posted 08-06-2016 05:35 AM


I always look at glueups as 5 minutes of terror because of how quickly the Titebond 2 I use
grabs the joints.
- skatefriday

Elmer’s wood glue grabs even quicker but sometimes I want that.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Robert's profile

Robert

3367 posts in 1839 days


#18 posted 08-06-2016 02:08 PM


Use less glue, you only need a few dabs on the panels.

YES!!! You obviously still have got to fine tune your glueing skills. You don’t need much.

Do this: 1 drop of glue on each corner of a 12×12 plywood panel + another on on top.
Clamp and wait 24 hours, then try to pry them apart.

How you apply glue also matters big.

I usually clean squeeze out immediately with a wet rag. If I don’t do it then, I’ll forget.
Scraping dried glue off the next day is horrible and will tear out certain wood.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

View Mark Shymanski's profile

Mark Shymanski

5623 posts in 4071 days


#19 posted 08-06-2016 09:34 PM

Why glue the panels at all? If there is no glue there it can’t squeeze out? Could you put a small brad from the back to hole the panel so it wouldn’t rattle?

-- "Checking for square? What madness is this! The cabinet is square because I will it to be so!" Jeremy Greiner LJ Topic#20953 2011 Feb 2

View SuperCubber's profile

SuperCubber

1073 posts in 2642 days


#20 posted 08-06-2016 09:43 PM



Why glue the panels at all? If there is no glue there it can t squeeze out? Could you put a small brad from the back to hole the panel so it wouldn t rattle?

- Mark Shymanski

Yes, mainly just to try and prevent rattle. I’ve tried just putting a little glue inside the groove where it meets the panel.

Thanks for all the input.

-- Joe | Spartanburg, SC | "To give anything less than your best is to sacrafice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine

View skatefriday's profile

skatefriday

452 posts in 1841 days


#21 posted 08-07-2016 03:39 PM

You can buy little rubber balls from cabinet hardware supply shops to prevent rattles on doors. Bob Lang suggests a hot glue gun for drawer bottoms where it won’t be visible.

View marshallmosby56's profile

marshallmosby56

18 posts in 1038 days


#22 posted 08-28-2016 08:14 PM

Apparently you have tried the usual methods and haven’t got any success. I must say removing glue from wood is a heck, especially when its all set. The first thing that I would recommend is that you cover the squeezed out glue with paper so that it would soak up the extra amount. This probably would leave you a much lesser amount of glue to clean. Secondly when you get the visible glue after two or three days, you should try getting a four-sided glue scraper. It is sharp on all edges and is quite thick to efficiently scrape off the solidified glue without going all blunt.
Give it a try and share your experience.

-- :)

View Cooler's profile

Cooler

299 posts in 1201 days


#23 posted 08-29-2016 01:56 PM

Are you using a glue brush to apply? I find I get the most uniform application with the glue brush.

A wet rag on MDF’s machined surfaces will raise the “grain” and will look horrible when painted. So make sure that the rag is just barely damp.

Also if you are using a waterbased finish, then a dewaxed shellac (SealCoat works well) as a primer will prevent the “grain” from raising. It dries in 30 minutes so it does not slow things down much.

-- This post is a hand-crafted natural product. Slight variations in spelling and grammar should not be viewed as flaws or defects, but rather as an integral characteristic of the creative process.

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