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View Straightbowed's profile

SCARY SHARP

by Straightbowed
posted 02-12-2013 12:39 AM


27 replies so far

View paratrooper34's profile

paratrooper34

916 posts in 4240 days


#1 posted 02-12-2013 12:44 AM

I would say you should figure out what your budget is and start from there. Once you determine how much you can spend, you can figure out what you can purchase to get you where you want to be.

I understand you want to do it on the cheap, so if you could provide a budget amount, we may be more able to point you in the right direction.

-- Mike

View Straightbowed's profile

Straightbowed

717 posts in 3586 days


#2 posted 02-12-2013 12:44 AM

well hell I forgot I already commented on and know about scary sharp but really I was wondering about diamond paste and what type of steel you can use or does any steel flat work or does it need a lite tooling mark or marks to help the paste to inbed for sharpening thatnks for any replies

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

View Straightbowed's profile

Straightbowed

717 posts in 3586 days


#3 posted 02-12-2013 12:47 AM

I just woke up I work nights so you have to look over me just throw some suggestions Im open to any

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

7933 posts in 4202 days


#4 posted 02-12-2013 12:50 AM

I have to say that I have had great success with 220, 320, 600grit and then a BLACK Arkansas stone. All on a HD Granite tile (about $4.50). I have now moved beyond that, but that is enough to do very well.

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

View bobasaurus's profile

bobasaurus

3743 posts in 4472 days


#5 posted 02-12-2013 12:50 AM

Waterstones are my favorite. You can get them pretty cheap. You’ll want at least 8k grit for proper plane sharpening. All you really need is one coarse and one super fine.

-- Allen, Colorado (Instagram @bobasaurus_woodworking)

View Benvolio's profile

Benvolio

148 posts in 3219 days


#6 posted 02-12-2013 01:06 AM

I just finished with using papers. I really didn’t find it that cheap – 2500 frit paper is expensive and it gets clogged with iron swarf so quickly it stops being effective super quickly.

I recently invested in waterstone set – surprisingly inexpensive for the course grits.

Maybe finish off by stopping after 1000 grit?

-- Ben, England.

View JNP's profile

JNP

113 posts in 3865 days


#7 posted 02-12-2013 01:15 AM

I went through the same process wanting cheap, easy, quality…can’t be done. The paper seems the cheaper route but the cost of it really adds up. I’m going to do the DMT diamond stones and call it a day. Much more convenient and I’m sure will be cheaper in the longer run.

-- Jeff

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

7933 posts in 4202 days


#8 posted 02-12-2013 01:49 AM

Benvolio,
No offense, but if you are going to 2500-grit with paper, then IMO you are drinking too much of the KoolAid. After 600-grit, I find the brown grocery sack paper (~3,000-grit) to be MORE than enough, AND IT IS CHEAP!

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

View Benvolio's profile

Benvolio

148 posts in 3219 days


#9 posted 02-12-2013 02:01 AM

HorizontalMike – no offence taken. I couldn’t actually find a lot of material online to guide me on how to sandpaper sharpen. I just figured the finer the grit, the better (and by jove was it sharp!!)

you’ll laugh as well when I tell you my regimen was:

120
180
220
240
320
400
600
800
1000
1600
2000
2500

I found out recently I could have skipped a couple of stages.

we live and learn.

-- Ben, England.

View Straightbowed's profile

Straightbowed

717 posts in 3586 days


#10 posted 02-12-2013 03:32 AM

gee guys the hidden Question was WHAT ABOUT THA DIAMOND PASTE????? how do you like it? I just went outside and used some .05 micron on my tablesaw wing with my plane blade but the plane was sharp with 2000 grit paper, to start now it will cut with the blade set very fine on a stanley NO 3 at .0005 thats what I measured with my calipers on cherry wood but I really didn’t set it as fine as I could I just set it to take a lighter shave but I was lookin for something special that someone mite know the little secret but mainly planeing with the grain is the most important thing as I was using some oak and with or against the grain oak really lets you know the way the grain is

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

View Don W's profile

Don W

20247 posts in 3855 days


#11 posted 02-12-2013 03:45 AM

I do 90% of my sharpening with a $60 home depot grinder, a $55 aluminum oxide wheel for the grinder and an $18 flea market oil stone. I made a strop for stripping the burr but Mikes idea with the brown paper will work as well.

I’ve got more expensive equipment but keep coming back to the process above.

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

View Straightbowed's profile

Straightbowed

717 posts in 3586 days


#12 posted 02-12-2013 05:48 PM

Hey horizontal MIKEY
what the hell is brown sac paper on the cheapside???

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

7933 posts in 4202 days


#13 posted 02-14-2013 10:11 PM

Here you go Straightbowed, 35in X 140ft for $10.97 and I do call that cheap. And it is wide enough to cover my workbench.

Trimaco 35 in. x 140 ft. Brown Builder's Paper

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

View Milo's profile

Milo

869 posts in 4607 days


#14 posted 02-14-2013 10:15 PM

Straightbowed,

I odn’t even know what diamond paste is, but I think you would be happier in the long run to buy some Arkansas oil stones. They are not that expensive, and will last a lot longer. I plan on looking for some at the Tampa Woodworks show next month.

Milo

-- Beer, Beer, Thank God for Beer. It's my way of keeping my mind fresh and clear...

View ScottinTexas's profile

ScottinTexas

108 posts in 3236 days


#15 posted 02-15-2013 12:54 AM

Do you guys hold the blade angle by hand? I just can’t see how all this grit matters so much if you ARE going to be moving the blade angle no matter how much you try and the cutting edge will be thus rounded (albeit microscopically.)

View derosa's profile

derosa

1597 posts in 4123 days


#16 posted 02-15-2013 01:28 AM

Mike- is that about the same texture/density as the paper bags my groceries come in?

-- A posse ad esse

View oldnovice's profile

oldnovice

7757 posts in 4655 days


#17 posted 02-15-2013 02:28 AM

To steal Mike’s reply, the brown paper grocery bags are bout the same but there is a lot more variability from store to store.

I use it for the same sharpening technique, it’s cheap, and sharp!

-- "Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." -- Aldous Huxley

View Don W's profile

Don W

20247 posts in 3855 days


#18 posted 02-15-2013 03:15 AM

We don’t have brown paper bags any more. Its all plastic stuff.

-- http://timetestedtools.net - Collecting is an investment in the past, and the future.

View BentheViking's profile

BentheViking

1782 posts in 3852 days


#19 posted 02-15-2013 03:49 AM

usually trader joes or whole foods has paper bags…since we are trying to talk about how to do things on the cheap maybe see if a cashier will just give you a few

-- It's made of wood. Real sturdy.--Chubbs Peterson

View Straightbowed's profile

Straightbowed

717 posts in 3586 days


#20 posted 02-15-2013 04:07 AM

to Milo I used some paste the other day and that crap does the job hell I just put some on my TS top and ran my blade over it and it made a mirror finish and was scary sharp .0005 shavin TO MIKEY I have a whole roll of that stuff in the shop HOW DO YOU USE IT????????

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

View Dark_Lightning's profile

Dark_Lightning

4952 posts in 4397 days


#21 posted 02-15-2013 04:25 AM

I believe Jamie Speirs (sp?) did a video about diamond stones that was right to the point about sharpening.

-- Steven.......Random Orbital Nailer

View Ripthorn's profile

Ripthorn

1459 posts in 4273 days


#22 posted 02-15-2013 03:25 PM

I like the 3M lapping film available from Lee Valley or TFWW. Never used diamond paste, but have heard you can put it on just about anything that’s flat, including MDF.

-- Brian T. - Exact science is not an exact science

View camps764's profile

camps764

867 posts in 3648 days


#23 posted 02-15-2013 03:33 PM

I’m going to give the paper bag trick a try and see.

Just my $.02 on the original question, I’ve had pretty good success with Scary Sharp and sand paper, but others are right…initially it is cheaper than stones, but in the long run the paper gets expensive. I think, like most everything in woodworking, it is worth it in the long run to spend the extra money up front to get quality tools/stones.

Does this mean you need to purchase the Worksharp 3000 to get sharp tools? Not necessarily…but a good set of stones is probably worth the cost when you stretch it out over the lifetime of the tool.

-- Steve

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

7933 posts in 4202 days


#24 posted 02-15-2013 03:33 PM

I just PM’d Steve about ‘how to use’, but will post this same information below for everyone’s benefit:

This is basically contractor’s paper used to cover the floor during construction and/or renovation (AKA a drop cloth). I use it to cover my workbench for glue-ups and finishing. My bench is 30in wide by 90in long. I accidentally found out how well it works while cleaning up and gluing some large mortise an tenons with my chisels. When my chisels got gluey from cleaning up the joint (scraping), I started wiping the chisel bevel and flats on the contractor’s paper on the bench. I started noticing that the shine on the bevels got brighter and brighter than they had ever been from my sharpening, and they seemed to get even sharper.

After some short research, I discovered that the brown “sac” paper that this contractor’s paper is made from, actually has a grit equivalent of more than 3,000 which is more than twice my Black Hard Arkansas stone that has just 1,200 grit.

I am not trying to be anal about this, or about sharpening in general, but all this reaches a practical limit at some point. Mine is the above for honing “while at the bench”. I now have a HF 4×36in belt sander that I converted to a belt sharpening system and am now using the buffing wheel with ‘green’ polish (10,000 grit) to achieve much the same results.

I reviewed that belt sander conversion to sharpening system HERE.

That said, I find it much easier to take a couple of pull-swipes on the contractor’s paper spread underneath the current project that I am working on, than it is to stop and move elsewhere to re-hone a chisel. I do not even have to stop working or even take a step. It is that easy.

When I have to stop and re-hone handplanes, I am now using my belt-sharpener and honing wheel, but using the paper is always an option since I always keep my bench covered with the paper.

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

View camps764's profile

camps764

867 posts in 3648 days


#25 posted 02-15-2013 03:38 PM

Great info Mike! It’s cool when people stumble across things like this. I’m going to pick some of this up this afternoon and give it a shot. At the very least I will have something disposable for covering the bench – at the best I will have a great alternative honing surface.

-- Steve

View waho6o9's profile

waho6o9

9105 posts in 3865 days


#26 posted 02-15-2013 03:41 PM

Maybe put a little green honing compound on the contractor paper and give it
a go and see what happens.

View Ron Harper's profile

Ron Harper

133 posts in 3204 days


#27 posted 02-25-2013 05:49 PM

I use oil stones and Paul Sellers honing method. My tools are very very sharp. You can search Paul Sellers honing on Youtube. It works just exactly like he says it does. This is probably the most controversial topic in the area of hand tools. The truth is, there are about 5 different sharpening/ honing methods. They will all put a surgical edge on your cutting edges. The secret is to pick one and tay with it. You can get fair results soon. It will take a while to get really good at any of them. I have been doing the Sellers method since October. I am just now getting to the point that from the time i stop planing till I resume planing takes a little over two minutes. Understand that m honing station is set up an ready to go at the start if each work session. Honing is the most foundational skill of hand tool woodworking. So many guy get frustrated needlessly in the shop because hey do not pay enough attention to this activity.

-- Ron in Kokomo

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