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View DeWolf's profile

why is framing unfinished?

by DeWolf
posted 09-08-2019 08:28 PM


24 replies so far

View Bill White's profile

Bill White

5349 posts in 5011 days


#1 posted 09-08-2019 09:22 PM

Floor plates are usually treated. Wall framing is not. I would not want to live in a home that was totally built with pressure treated lumber framing. Have you seen how wet that stuff is when newly bought?

-- [email protected]

View ibewjon's profile

ibewjon

2347 posts in 3844 days


#2 posted 09-08-2019 11:56 PM

The framing should never get wet, and the cost would be prohibitive. If it gets that wet, there are bigger problems to worry about.

View Bunyon's profile

Bunyon

16 posts in 1315 days


#3 posted 09-09-2019 12:12 AM

I would also think the finish could still possibly fail under water exposure. Depending on the type of finish, It could also make it toxic, making it harder and more expensive to get rid of the cut-offs. The exterior finish is what needs to keep moisture away from the wood.
I have seen plenty of water rotted wood, including pressure treated wood. Eventually, even treated wood will break down under extreme circumstances.

-- Living the dream up here in Strathroy, Ontario, Canada

View pottz's profile

pottz

16107 posts in 2035 days


#4 posted 09-09-2019 03:06 PM

to treat or add a finish to a framed home would be very expensive and serve no real purpose.as said if your frame of your house gets wet youve got a real problem that finished framing lumber wouldn’t solve.ive never even heard of anyone using finished lumber to frame a house.

-- working with my hands is a joy,it gives me a sense of fulfillment,somthing so many seek and so few find.-SAM MALOOF.

View Andre's profile

Andre

4442 posts in 2856 days


#5 posted 09-09-2019 03:25 PM

Seen some new houses being built with extensive use of mold/fire resistant materials, house across the street was bright pink, 2 by 4s and sheeting. Really stood out until they put on the wrap and siding. Floor joists were green and I think the support beams are a yellow, orange color. Scrap cut offs not much use for fire pit:)

-- Lifting one end of the plank.

View tomsteve's profile

tomsteve

1158 posts in 2270 days


#6 posted 09-09-2019 03:29 PM

when wood structures are built AND maintained properly, there is no need for any sort of treatment to avoid water damage.
that RV probably wouldnt have had the damage of it was maintained properly. too many people get em, use em, and never do any maintenance. those things are shaking,bouncing, vibrating, and moving a lot when traveling down roads. things are bound to happen and need maintaining.
the roof on an rv is the most neglected area. out of site out of mind. some say annual maintenance on them. i say every 6 months.

View MrRon's profile

MrRon

6005 posts in 4294 days


#7 posted 09-09-2019 07:02 PM

Mobile homes and trailers were never designed to survive a flood as from a hurricane. Any finish put on wall studs would soon get water logged and that would prevent the wood from drying out.

View edapp's profile

edapp

347 posts in 2480 days


#8 posted 09-09-2019 07:06 PM

Same reason you dont joint/plane boards to be perfectly flat straight and square. Time, cost, and no real benefit to doing so in the final product.

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

28230 posts in 3734 days


#9 posted 09-09-2019 07:17 PM

Unless the house is a Tudor design…..

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View therealSteveN's profile

therealSteveN

7463 posts in 1625 days


#10 posted 09-10-2019 08:41 AM



The framing should never get wet, and the cost would be prohibitive. If it gets that wet, there are bigger problems to worry about.

- ibewjon

I agree. But all of my understanding of construction is on houses, and none of them had wheels???? Really not sure, but I would think the same thought applies to rollers.

-- Think safe, be safe

View Robert's profile

Robert

4519 posts in 2531 days


#11 posted 09-10-2019 02:19 PM

Finish will not protect wood in a flood. Don’t believe me? Throw your dining table in the pond and see what happens :-D

Wood has to be pressure treated or of a species resistant to rot in order to achieve what you want.

Brings up a point my brother built a beach house many years ago and code required all the inside framing to be pressure treated up the the second story.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

View Sark's profile

Sark

402 posts in 1411 days


#12 posted 09-10-2019 03:10 PM

I’ll add a couple of thoughts:
Framing is done with green/wet wood, not kiln dried wood. Wet wood is more flexible, resists splitting better, holds screws without pre-drilling and in general is more forgiving to use when doing a framing project. You will not find dried lumber on a construction site, except for trim work, moldings, special beams, etc… but the dimensioned lumber used for framing is wet.

I can think of one exception, and that is the Green and Green Gamble house in Pasadena, where in the attic all the visible lumber, rafters, etc… was beautifully finished. Now that famous house was the work of about 200 craftsmen who worked for 2 years on it. 400 man-years of labor. Worth a visit if you’re in California and want to see perfection in woodworking.

View Kazooman's profile

Kazooman

1540 posts in 3003 days


#13 posted 09-10-2019 03:26 PM

Metal studs don’t rot.

View ibewjon's profile

ibewjon

2347 posts in 3844 days


#14 posted 09-10-2019 03:30 PM

Framing is not done with green, wet wood. The wood is kiln dried, just to a higher level of moisture than furniture grade lumber. About 15% for construction grade I think.

View Andre's profile

Andre

4442 posts in 2856 days


#15 posted 09-10-2019 04:38 PM



Same reason you dont joint/plane boards to be perfectly flat straight and square. Time, cost, and no real benefit to doing so in the final product.

- edapp

LOL! are you the guy who framed (tried) my house? I was banned from site in the first week but I made sure walls were straight and square!

-- Lifting one end of the plank.

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

6474 posts in 3359 days


#16 posted 09-10-2019 05:45 PM



Metal studs don t rot.

- Kazooman

They do rust, seen it many times.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

6474 posts in 3359 days


#17 posted 09-10-2019 08:01 PM


Same reason you dont joint/plane boards to be perfectly flat straight and square. Time, cost, and no real benefit to doing so in the final product.

- edapp

LOL! are you the guy who framed (tried) my house? I was banned from site in the first week but I made sure walls were straight and square!

- Andre


I remember back in the 50’s my dad built house in Sacramento Calif. The framing inspector would bring a long straight edge with him. He’d go around placing the straight edge horizontally on the walls checking for bowed studs. Those that didn’t make the grade was marked with a red X and had to be straightened before the framing was passed.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View MSquared's profile

MSquared

1152 posts in 965 days


#18 posted 09-10-2019 08:24 PM

Many years ago, a Condo complex was going up near where I lived. They were going great guns wood framing the first two units. They left all that framing open to the elements for days then weeks. Not a tarp to be seen anywhere. I told my buddy that it’s gonna be a big problem once the rest of the sheathing, roofing and siding gets applied and the building ‘sealed up’. Sure enough, 8 months to year later, 40 apartments occupied, they were condemned due to black mold throughout the entire structures. They were torn down to the ground! Well, abated and dismantled is more accurate. Apparently, they hired a new project manager or someone who had the remaining construction covered each day. Whoa!! Talk about your law suits!!! Mega!

-- Marty, Long Island, NY

View DeWolf's profile

DeWolf

2 posts in 582 days


#19 posted 09-12-2019 05:23 AM

kinda glad I asked this, it’s been a delightful mix of hilarious and educational. :)

View wildwoodbybrianjohns's profile

wildwoodbybrianjohns

2757 posts in 598 days


#20 posted 09-12-2019 06:07 AM

My house was built in ´84, most of it is block and sandstone, with heavy wood ceiling beams. I did a total reno on this house myself, and I know every centimeter of it- there WAS nothing square nor level in the entire house. I had this joke going through my head many times as I was cursing the builders, goes like this-

Architect and owner are at site looking around, workers are busy. The architect pulls the foreman aside, says, hey, you see that wall there, (2 of the walls are banks of sash windows set between heavy beams) well all of the beams are off line, and it appears as they arent square either?

Foreman shruggs his head, says, oh well, the square and level we dont use, those are complicated tools, if you want us to use those, itll cost you double!

-- WWBBJ: It is better to be interesting and wrong, than boring and right.

View edapp's profile

edapp

347 posts in 2480 days


#21 posted 09-12-2019 01:01 PM


Same reason you dont joint/plane boards to be perfectly flat straight and square. Time, cost, and no real benefit to doing so in the final product.

- edapp

LOL! are you the guy who framed (tried) my house? I was banned from site in the first week but I made sure walls were straight and square!

- Andre

I remember back in the 50 s my dad built house in Sacramento Calif. The framing inspector would bring a long straight edge with him. He d go around placing the straight edge horizontally on the walls checking for bowed studs. Those that didn t make the grade was marked with a red X and had to be straightened before the framing was passed.

- AlaskaGuy

Right. You can have walls that are plenty straight without perfectly straight and square studs… which was my point. Same way you can have walls that never rot without applying a sealer to every stud.

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

28230 posts in 3734 days


#22 posted 09-12-2019 02:59 PM

All studs, and joists would arrive at the site….straight as can be, and banded so they stayed that way…..once we cut those metals bands, though…..you had to step back….and watch the outer layers move. Then you used the inner layers, saving the now crooked outer layers for blocking. Ones that were too badly bent up, were returned for credit, and maybe a few that were picked out of the store’s racks, IF you needed a few. Treated lumber was the worst at moving around, after the bandings were cut….almost had to jump back.

Then again, I was remodeling an older Balloon framed house….rough sawn, white oak 2” x 5” wall studs…..2 stories tall. With cut nails…..wood was too hard to nail, I had to predrill for screws, as nails simply either bounced off, or turned into a pretzel…wood had been sawn on site (1893) and the house was built from these. Wood was still green, and easy to nail, back then. Of course, the house was less than square, when I bought it…as it had settled…around the central chimney. Chimney didn’t move, but the house did settle..down. Field stone for the walls of the basement, topped with a few courses of brick.

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View controlfreak's profile

controlfreak

1964 posts in 652 days


#23 posted 09-12-2019 05:49 PM

I always thought it would be fun to watch a house get built back then. I imagine several guy moving hand saws. Wood lathe got nailed up and where ever the last stud was they flipped the hammer around and whacked the end piece off with the hatchet end. A neighbor I had years ago said his first job was using a brace and bit to drill holes for knob & tube wire. He got paid 25 cents a day.

View therealSteveN's profile

therealSteveN

7463 posts in 1625 days


#24 posted 09-14-2019 09:42 PM



All studs, and joists would arrive at the site….straight as can be, and banded so they stayed that way…..once we cut those metals bands, though…..you had to step back….and watch the outer layers move. Then you used the inner layers, saving the now crooked outer layers for blocking. Ones that were too badly bent up, were returned for credit, and maybe a few that were picked out of the store s racks, IF you needed a few. Treated lumber was the worst at moving around, after the bandings were cut….almost had to jump back.

- bandit571

I laughed at the step back part. Sometimes the only option is to dive, and save yourself. It is a somewhat magical happening though, not in a good sort of way though.

-- Think safe, be safe

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