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Glue removal tip wanted...

by jutsFL
posted 11-03-2018 03:41 PM


1 2 next »
54 replies

54 replies so far

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#1 posted 11-03-2018 03:55 PM

You answered you own question. Card scraper. Also a good way to fix any minor miss alignments between boards.

https://youtu.be/PM-5WPl63wc

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View jutsFL's profile

jutsFL

191 posts in 349 days


#2 posted 11-03-2018 04:25 PM

Thank you!
Being new, like a year in new, I dont even know the real names of the tools to know what to search for.

...is a card scraper of any functional difference than the handled paint scrapers I already own?

-- I've quickly learned that being a woodworker isn't about making flawless work, rather it's fixing all the mistakes you made so that it appears flawless to others! Jay - FL

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Smitty_Cabinetshop

16190 posts in 3126 days


#3 posted 11-03-2018 04:28 PM

Card scraper, paint scraper, either can work if shaped and sharpened properly. Yes, scrape before sanding is a great approach.

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. -- OldTools Archive --

View Andybb's profile (online now)

Andybb

2099 posts in 1111 days


#4 posted 11-03-2018 04:52 PM

Card/cabinet scraper videos

-- Andy - Seattle USA

View Rich's profile

Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#5 posted 11-03-2018 05:13 PM

I like to wait until the glue has just dried and you don’t see any wet glue down in the center of the bead and then slice it off with a chisel plane. It’s important not to wait until it’s fully hardened though. A stiff putty knife with a chisel edge will work too.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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Andre

2790 posts in 2313 days


#6 posted 11-03-2018 05:16 PM

I have a lot of old plane blades after switching all my Stanley’s to PMV-11 irons and found the old irons make excellent glue scrappers.

-- Lifting one end of the plank.

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GR8HUNTER

6444 posts in 1220 days


#7 posted 11-03-2018 05:26 PM

after first hour …. use your paint scraper then….. so it will easily come off :<))

-- Tony---- Reinholds,Pa.------ REMEMBER TO ALWAYS HAVE FUN

View jutsFL's profile

jutsFL

191 posts in 349 days


#8 posted 11-03-2018 05:46 PM

I just had the time to watch the first linked video, this is beautiful! Absolutely perfect , and exactly what I needed – thanks AlaskaGuy, and everyone for that matter.

...with the glue up I used (face referenced my dining table for flatness) I could not get to the glue on the face as it dried to scrape ahead of time. Live and learn I suppose.

-- I've quickly learned that being a woodworker isn't about making flawless work, rather it's fixing all the mistakes you made so that it appears flawless to others! Jay - FL

View Richard's profile

Richard

11307 posts in 3540 days


#9 posted 11-03-2018 09:26 PM



I have a lot of old plane blades after switching all my Stanley s to PMV-11 irons and found the old irons make excellent glue scrappers.

- Andre

Andre +1 Great Idea

Rick S.

-- Richard (Ontario, CANADA)

View Kazooman's profile

Kazooman

1357 posts in 2460 days


#10 posted 11-03-2018 09:56 PM



I just had the time to watch the first linked video, this is beautiful! Absolutely perfect , and exactly what I needed – thanks AlaskaGuy, and everyone for that matter.

...with the glue up I used (face referenced my dining table for flatness) I could not get to the glue on the face as it dried to scrape ahead of time. Live and learn I suppose.

- jutsFL

Yeh, that is the nature of the beast. I would imagine that you had some sort of plastic down to protect the table and the squeeze out got spread out pretty thin between the piece and the plastic.

First, a “great idea” commendation for using your dining room table as an assembly table. Second, a “most understanding spouse” commendation (if you are married) to whoever actually allowed you to do this. My wife is very understanding and supportive, but trust me, there ain’t no glue-ups happening on our dining room table!

The good news is that the squeeze out looks pretty limited and thin. I have found that if I get everything in place, lightly draw up the clamps, then tighten up a bit on the cauls before the final clamping pressure is applied most of the squeeze out is directed upwards (at least it seems that way). I do tend to use more cauls on a piece that size.

View jutsFL's profile

jutsFL

191 posts in 349 days


#11 posted 11-04-2018 12:24 AM


I just had the time to watch the first linked video, this is beautiful! Absolutely perfect , and exactly what I needed – thanks AlaskaGuy, and everyone for that matter.

...with the glue up I used (face referenced my dining table for flatness) I could not get to the glue on the face as it dried to scrape ahead of time. Live and learn I suppose.

- jutsFL

Yeh, that is the nature of the beast. I would imagine that you had some sort of plastic down to protect the table and the squeeze out got spread out pretty thin between the piece and the plastic.

First, a “great idea” commendation for using your dining room table as an assembly table. Second, a “most understanding spouse” commendation (if you are married) to whoever actually allowed you to do this. My wife is very understanding and supportive, but trust me, there ain t no glue-ups happening on our dining room table!

The good news is that the squeeze out looks pretty limited and thin. I have found that if I get everything in place, lightly draw up the clamps, then tighten up a bit on the cauls before the final clamping pressure is applied most of the squeeze out is directed upwards (at least it seems that way). I do tend to use more cauls on a piece that size.

- Kazooman

The dining table reference worked very well for the flatness of the panel… But had obvious shortcomings :)

...and, yes, my wife is wildly leniant with the stuff I get away with from this borderline obsession with woodworking. Not only was I able to use the table, but it remained there overnight – with my mother in law visiting at the time !

Appreciate the tip as well. Ive noticed very quickly from the gentleman I buy my lumber from in town – 10sec worth if a mans thoughts thats been doing this for a lifetime, is equivelent to roughly 7 days of profanity filled blunders in the garage :)

-- I've quickly learned that being a woodworker isn't about making flawless work, rather it's fixing all the mistakes you made so that it appears flawless to others! Jay - FL

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chrisstef

17960 posts in 3514 days


#12 posted 11-04-2018 12:49 AM

Fwiw i keep a deck of playing cards in the shop to use on squeeze out. Theyre stiff enough to run right along the joint with a lil curl to em to keep the wet glue on top of.

-- Its not a crack, its a casting imperfection.

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shipwright

8380 posts in 3305 days


#13 posted 11-04-2018 03:34 PM

........... or you could use hide glues and clean up with water.

Just sayin’

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

View Rich's profile

Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#14 posted 11-04-2018 04:15 PM


........... or you could use hide glues and clean up with water.

Just sayin

- shipwright

Glad you mentioned this. Besides easy cleanup, it can save your butt sometimes as well. Once I glued the dovetailed sides of a drawer to the front only later realizing I’d forgotten to cut the grooves for the drawer bottom. With PVA, I’d have had to scrap it and start over, but having used hide glue, I was able to separate the parts in about 10 minutes with a moist cloth and heat gun. Cleaning the joints for re-gluing was easy too.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#15 posted 11-04-2018 04:21 PM

I have ask this before but no one ever answers. What is the open time of Hide Glue. Can it be varied. Right now I have the impression hide glue give you abut a minute of open time. Such a short open time seems problematic.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Rich's profile

Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#16 posted 11-04-2018 04:52 PM


I have ask this before but no one ever answers. What is the open time of Hide Glue. Can it be varied. Right now I have the impression hide glue give you abut a minute of open time. Such a short open time seems problematic.

- AlaskaGuy

Liquid hide glue has a long open time. I can’t pin it down exactly, but it’s similar in my experience to PVA. However, it has a huge advantage of being slippery and helps joints go together effortlessly.

Hot hide glue has a quick tack. Paul has tons more experience with it than I do, but I like to use it when I’m building fixtures and other things I just want to stick together and use rather than clamping and waiting. In the event that you do need more open time, you can add urea.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#17 posted 11-04-2018 05:17 PM

I have ask this before but no one ever answers. What is the open time of Hide Glue. Can it be varied. Right now I have the impression hide glue give you abut a minute of open time. Such a short open time seems problematic.

- AlaskaGuy

Liquid hide glue has a long open time. I can t pin it down exactly, but it s similar in my experience to PVA. However, it has a huge advantage of being slippery and helps joints go together effortlessly.

Hot hide glue has a quick tack. Paul has tons more experience with it than I do, but I like to use it when I m building fixtures and other things I just want to stick together and use rather than clamping and waiting. In the event that you do need more open time, you can add urea.

- Rich


Thanks Rich. I have been toying with the idea of using some hide glue. Are there any real cons to the liquid version as far as strength, being able to clean up with water like the hot. etc etc. compared to the hot?

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#18 posted 11-04-2018 05:28 PM

BTW I will be using our search feature here at LJ. I know shipwright has posted quite a bit on the subject.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Rich's profile

Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#19 posted 11-04-2018 05:44 PM

Thanks Rich. I have been toying with the idea of using some hide glue. Are there any real cons to the liquid version as far as strength, being able to clean up with water like the hot. etc etc. compared to the hot?

- AlaskaGuy

Paul has some blog posts that are excellent reading. No, the only difference between LHG and HHG is the urea and that doesn’t reduce the strength. However, according to Fine Woodworking tests, hide glue is only about 75% as strong as PVA (with LHG a couple of percentage points stronger than HHG). For me, that’s not significant for things like dovetail joints, M&T, etc. You can use your judgment regarding which glue is best for a given situation. I’ve done my own simple tests and found that hide glue of either type has never broken on the glue line.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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shipwright

8380 posts in 3305 days


#20 posted 11-04-2018 09:40 PM

I agree with Rich. Once you have a bond that is in excess of the strength of the wood it becomes a moot point. Also of course there is stronger and weaker hot hide glue. I don’t know what gram strength Fine Woodworking used. Then there is water content, temperature, assembly efficiency, etc. So the hide glue that they used, the way they used it and at the consistency and temperature they used … was 75% as strong as pva.

Rant over.

My blog series is here: http://lumberjocks.com/shipwright/blog/series/5437

Also Rich only addressed strength. HHG also differs from LHG in the several issues related to tack time like rub joints (that he touched on) and hammer veneering. In a warm shop you have time with HHG to do most simple glue ups. I only use LHG when a glue up is complex.

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#21 posted 11-04-2018 09:52 PM



I have ask this before but no one ever answers. What is the open time of Hide Glue. Can it be varied. Right now I have the impression hide glue give you abut a minute of open time. Such a short open time seems problematic.

- AlaskaGuy

Tact time is a function of the glue strength. The typical HHG has a gram strength of around 250 and that gives you an open time of around 10 minutes. The stronger glues that run over 300 gram strength will have an open time of about one minute.

If you’re going to use LHG, go with Old Brown over Titebond, it’s much better from the tests.

View Rich's profile

Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#22 posted 11-04-2018 10:57 PM

And… I can’t believe I forgot to mention another huge benefit of hide glue and that’s that it fluoresces. That means with a $10 UV flashlight you can see excess glue before it bites you in the rear at finishing time. Also, even if you choose to stick with PVA glue (lots of puns lately, sorry), Titebond makes Titebond II with fluorescent dye added. I use it exclusively when I’m using PVA glue and you’d be amazed at how much glue you miss cleaning up. Finally, off the subject of glue, a UV flashlight is immensely effective at finding flaws in your finish that you’d normally need just the right angle of light or to feel it with your fingers in order to know they’re there.

My blog series about UV in the shop is here: http://lumberjocks.com/RichTaylor/blog/series/20577

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

View shipwright's profile

shipwright

8380 posts in 3305 days


#23 posted 11-05-2018 12:12 AM


Tact time is a function of the glue strength. The typical HHG has a gram strength of around 250 and that gives you an open time of around 10 minutes. The stronger glues that run over 300 gram strength will have an open time of about one minute.

If you re going to use LHG, go with Old Brown over Titebond, it s much better from the tests.

- lumbering_on

I agree that tack time is a function of gram strength but disagree on a couple of your other points. The general woodworking strength is usually given as 192gm. I prefer the somewhat slower 180 gm but there is little difference.
You must have a much hotter shop than I if you are getting 10 minutes open time with 250 gm HHG. The much slower 192 and 180 that I use, even on the hot side at 150F, gives me only a couple of minutes before it starts to gel.

High gram strengths are mostly used as far as I know by luthiers glueing relatively small joints that must endure high stresses.

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#24 posted 11-05-2018 12:22 AM

Tact time is a function of the glue strength. The typical HHG has a gram strength of around 250 and that gives you an open time of around 10 minutes. The stronger glues that run over 300 gram strength will have an open time of about one minute.

If you re going to use LHG, go with Old Brown over Titebond, it s much better from the tests.

- lumbering_on

I agree that tack time is a function of gram strength but disagree on a couple of your other points. The general woodworking strength is usually given as 192gm. I prefer the somewhat slower 180 gm but there is little difference.
You must have a much hotter shop than I if you are getting 10 minutes open time with 250 gm HHG. The much slower 192 and 180 that I use, even on the hot side at 150F, gives me only a couple of minutes before it starts to gel.

High gram strengths are mostly used as far as I know by luthiers glueing relatively small joints that must endure high stresses.

- shipwright

I’ll have to go dig out the package and see what it is. I was sure I was using 251 gram strength, but you could be correct, I could be using the 192 gm. I haven’t used it in a few years as it was for a course I was doing, and I could have sworn that they said it was 251 gm that was normal, and 192 was for non-stressed joints. However, I’ve been mistaken on a few things lately that I used to be able to rhyme off without any problems.

My memory’s been fading so badly that I forget I’m getting old. :(

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#25 posted 11-05-2018 12:50 AM

I couldn’t find the glue package, but I did find a few notes. From this it was saying that 192 and 251 are common strengths for cabinet making, and the open time for 251 was 1 minute. However, if you add 15% salt you can extend the time to 5 minutes, and you can extend it even longer by adding urea. It also says that urea and salt will allow you to create liquid hide glue.

So my memory is a bit off, and I’ll certainly defer to you on the 192 being more common, as I sure you use it a lot more than my teachers did.

View Rich's profile

Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#26 posted 11-05-2018 01:02 AM


However, if you add 15% salt you can extend the time to 5 minutes, and you can extend it even longer by adding urea. It also says that urea and salt will allow you to create liquid hide glue.

- lumbering_on

That’s what I said in posts 16 and 19 — sans the mention of salt, which I would never use. Also, there’s more to creating a quality LHG than just mixing the parts.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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shipwright

8380 posts in 3305 days


#27 posted 11-05-2018 01:06 AM

One minute sounds about right for 251gm. Of course once you start adding ingerdients you start losing the very properties that make HHG different from LHG. It is a continuum with full tack HHG at one end and LHG at the other however most of the time one end of the spectrum or the other is selected for its particular undiluted properties.

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#28 posted 11-05-2018 01:51 AM

However, if you add 15% salt you can extend the time to 5 minutes, and you can extend it even longer by adding urea. It also says that urea and salt will allow you to create liquid hide glue.

- lumbering_on

That s what I said in posts 16 and 19 — sans the mention of salt, which I would never use. Also, there s more to creating a quality LHG than just mixing the parts.

- Rich

Which is why I don’t mix my own liquid glue. I’ve used Old Brown before, but the open time on that is something like 30 minutes, and you need to keep pressure on it for 12 hours. But at least it doesn’t smell so bad. :)

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#29 posted 11-05-2018 01:59 AM



One minute sounds about right for 251gm. Of course once you start adding ingerdients you start losing the very properties that make HHG different from LHG. It is a continuum with full tack HHG at one end and LHG at the other however most of the time one end of the spectrum or the other is selected for its particular undiluted properties.

- shipwright

I remember that they provided the glue with a longer tack time as most of us had trouble doing glue ups in the short time that we needed. Our teachers could move fast, but we were just hobbyists, so we don’t have the same speed.

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Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#30 posted 11-05-2018 02:15 AM


Which is why I don t mix my own liquid glue. I ve used Old Brown before, but the open time on that is something like 30 minutes, and you need to keep pressure on it for 12 hours. But at least it doesn t smell so bad. :)

- lumbering_on

I’m sorry that this thread has gone so far off-piste, but I don’t like the idea that LJs who are just learning about hide glues get false information. OBG does not require long clamping time. You should give it 12 hours or more to fully cure due to the amount of water in the glue, but clamping time can be as short as 30 minutes, depending on the climate in the shop.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#31 posted 11-05-2018 02:31 AM

I’m sorry that this thread has gone so far off-piste, but I don’t like the idea that LJs who are just learning about hide glues get false information. OBG does not require long clamping time. You should give it 12 hours or more to fully cure due to the amount of water in the glue, but clamping time can be as short as 30 minutes, depending on the climate in the shop.

- Rich

The open time according to Old Brown themselves is 30 minutes, so clamp time would be longer. It would also depend on stress or no stress. I was told to allow 12 hours of clamping time to ensure the joint was strong, but that’s likely just being cautious. It’s like PVA, you can create a strong rub joint without clamps, if you want, but I don’t do it.

In any case, I’m not trying to tell someone that hide glue isn’t something they should use. I think a good place for them to start is on the Old Brown website and use the ‘Ask Patrick’ feature.

http://www.oldbrownglue.com/index.php

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AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#32 posted 11-05-2018 02:47 AM

Thanks for all the input to my question/s on hide glue. I have some reading to do. I have already decided to order a bottle of “Old Brown Glue” to get me started. From there I’ll be looking at inexpensive DIY glue pots in anticipation of ordering some HHG. BTW I did read somewhere that repeated heating and cooling can/will reduce glue strength. I’m not overly concerned about glue strength. History has proven it strong enough to do its job.

To the OP, I must apologize if I hijacked the thread. I hope you got the information you needed and come back often.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#33 posted 11-05-2018 03:13 AM


The open time according to Old Brown themselves is 30 minutes, so clamp time would be longer. It would also depend on stress or no stress. I was told to allow 12 hours of clamping time to ensure the joint was strong, but that s likely just being cautious. It s like PVA, you can create a strong rub joint without clamps, if you want, but I don t do it.

- lumbering_on

I’m speaking from years of experience. You? Actually, your second sentence shows there is hope for you :) Clamp time and time to support a load are two different things. I build dozens of projects per month for my business and don’t have time for classroom rules about clamp time. If it holds, it’s done.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#34 posted 11-05-2018 03:20 AM

The open time according to Old Brown themselves is 30 minutes, so clamp time would be longer. It would also depend on stress or no stress. I was told to allow 12 hours of clamping time to ensure the joint was strong, but that s likely just being cautious. It s like PVA, you can create a strong rub joint without clamps, if you want, but I don t do it.

- lumbering_on

I’m speaking from years of experience. You? Actually, your second sentence shows there is hope for you :) Clamp time and time to support a load are two different things. I build dozens of projects per month for my business and don’t have time for classroom rules about clamp time. If it holds, it’s done.

- Rich

There have been many of times I’ve ran glued up panels ( cabinet door size) though my planer or sander after 20 minutes clamp time. Haven’t had one fall apart yet. Edit to add and I’m sure you know I’m speaking of PVA glue.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#35 posted 11-05-2018 03:26 AM

I’m speaking from years of experience. You? Actually, your second sentence shows there is hope for you :) Clamp time and time to support a load are two different things. I build dozens of projects per month for my business and don’t have time for classroom rules about clamp time. If it holds, it’s done.

- Rich

Well at least there is hope. :P

I’ve been wood working for the better part of 30 years, although I had to take a few years off. I just don’t use hide glues a lot as I find PVA does what I need. I actually learned hide glue early on as the teachers I had loved their traditional methods, but it was expensive and wasn’t easy to find. However, if that’s what you find, then I’ll defer to your experience. I can only go by what I was told, and sometimes, it’s overly cautious, sometimes it’s actually wrong, but that’s what this forum is for.

—Ok, I started back in 1983, but I hate thinking it’s that long ago. :(

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Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#36 posted 11-05-2018 03:30 AM


I ve been wood working for the better part of 30 years, although I had to take a few years off. I just don t use hide glues a lot as I find PVA does what I need. I actually learned hide glue early on as the teachers I had loved their traditional methods, but it was expensive and wasn t easy to find.

—Ok, I started back in 1983, but I hate thinking it s that long ago. :(

- lumbering_on

That’s great. I’m sure you are very talented. I can’t wait to see some of your project posts.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#37 posted 11-05-2018 04:00 AM


—Ok, I started back in 1983, but I hate thinking it s that long ago. :(

- lumbering_on

I started back in 1960 and I’m very thankful to still be around and able to work. Celebrate your age; it beats the hell out of the alternative.

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#38 posted 11-05-2018 04:04 AM


—Ok, I started back in 1983, but I hate thinking it s that long ago. :(

- lumbering_on

I started back in 1960 and I m very thankful to still be around and able to work. Celebrate your age; it beats the hell out of the alternative.

- Rich

That’s true. I have no desire to explore it, but it will come. :(

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Rich

4977 posts in 1097 days


#39 posted 11-05-2018 04:06 AM


:(

- lumbering_on

Turn that frown upside down :)

-- There are 10 types of people—those who understand binary, and those who don’t

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therealSteveN

3878 posts in 1082 days


#40 posted 11-05-2018 04:34 AM

++++ for hide glue, even the ready in the bottle stuff is reversible, and much easier to clean than PVA.

On PVA I also use a sharp edge to crack off dried, but much prefer to take it off when it’s kinda set. It will come off, and not smear into the grain. DO NOT do a Norm, and wipe moist glue off with a damp cloth, it will drive the wet glue into the grain, and you will almost always see it in your finished project, unless you sand well into the board, but by them you can see dips, almost as bad as a glue smear.

-- Think safe, be safe

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lumbering_on

578 posts in 997 days


#41 posted 11-05-2018 04:49 AM


:(

- lumbering_on

Turn that frown upside down :)

- Rich

:)

I’m alive, and it’s pretty good right now. I can only hope I’ll have as many good years as you. :)

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shipwright

8380 posts in 3305 days


#42 posted 11-05-2018 05:10 AM

For the record “cooking” does not weaken HHG. In fact it makes it stronger.

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#43 posted 11-05-2018 06:26 AM



For the record “cooking” does not weaken HHG. In fact it makes it stronger.

- shipwright


This is the source for my miss-information

https://www.spurlocktools.com/tech_tips1.htm

Excerpt from article.

Additional tips: • Glue strength gradually declines with extended heating or repeated cooling and reheating. You can successfully reheat hide glue several times for non-critical work like gluing on dampers, back rail cloth, etc. (store covered in the refrigerator between uses). However, for high strength uses like wood working or hammer hanging, always mix it fresh. • Common lore is to mix the glue crystals with cold water only, then let it sit overnight before heating. I believe this is unnecessary and have always mixed and heated immediately with excellent results

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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TheFridge

10859 posts in 1993 days


#44 posted 11-05-2018 06:30 AM

I repeatedly freeze/thaw mine. Clean up isn’t a easy with an old batch from my experience.

On a different note, if you use a scraper to get the glue up, give it a shot scraping the rest of the panel. I do the same. I rarely use sandpaper.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

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AlaskaGuy

5350 posts in 2817 days


#45 posted 11-05-2018 06:40 AM


I repeatedly freeze/thaw mine. Clean up isn’t a easy with an old batch from my experience.

On a different note, if you use a scraper to get the glue up, give it a shot scraping the rest of the panel. I do the same. I rarely use sandpaper.

- TheFridge


I never let my glue get out of control to where I need a scraper. First I’ve learned ” don’t use so much glue” ” wait until the squeeze out beads are semi hard (30 to 40 minutes) and cut them off with a chisel and your done.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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OSU55

2403 posts in 2497 days


#46 posted 11-05-2018 01:26 PM

To the OP, plenty of advice for glue removal. I use chisels or a flush plane to get the worst of it then a Stanley #80 to get all of it. Have you thought of using hand planes instead of ros to flatten and prep a panel glue up? Actually faster with superior results. Sanding will never get as flat as planing.

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jutsFL

191 posts in 349 days


#47 posted 11-05-2018 02:12 PM



To the OP, plenty of advice for glue removal. I use chisels or a flush plane to get the worst of it then a Stanley #80 to get all of it. Have you thought of using hand planes instead of ros to flatten and prep a panel glue up? Actually faster with superior results. Sanding will never get as flat as planing.

...among the long list of needed skills for me. At my current level, a hand plane scares me sideways, and id never go near my top with one (as of now:)!
- OSU55


-- I've quickly learned that being a woodworker isn't about making flawless work, rather it's fixing all the mistakes you made so that it appears flawless to others! Jay - FL

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jutsFL

191 posts in 349 days


#48 posted 11-05-2018 02:13 PM



To the OP, plenty of advice for glue removal. I use chisels or a flush plane to get the worst of it then a Stanley #80 to get all of it. Have you thought of using hand planes instead of ros to flatten and prep a panel glue up? Actually faster with superior results. Sanding will never get as flat as planing.
- OSU55

...among the long list of needed skills for me. At my current level, a hand plane scares me sideways, and id never go near my top with one (as of now:)!

-- I've quickly learned that being a woodworker isn't about making flawless work, rather it's fixing all the mistakes you made so that it appears flawless to others! Jay - FL

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Robert

3537 posts in 1988 days


#49 posted 11-05-2018 02:37 PM

juts,

To answer your question, get the glue off before it dries. Sanding and scraping dried glue off can lead to over sanding errors and with a scraper, you risk tearnig wood out. Not to mention in some species of wood, you cannot get the dried glue out of open pores without planing or drum sanding the entire top.

Using just the right amount of glue comes with experience and is the first step in simplifying glue clean up.

Here’s what has worked for me for >25 years:

1. Scrape the squeeze out off with a putty knife
2. Wipe remaining glue with a damp (not soaking wet) rag or sponge. In some cases like corners I use a soft bristle toothbrush followed by a putty knife wrapped in a paper towel or rag.
3. Follow up with a dry paper towel.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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shipwright

8380 posts in 3305 days


#50 posted 11-05-2018 04:02 PM


This is the source for my miss-information

https://www.spurlocktools.com/tech_tips1.htm

Excerpt from article.

Additional tips: • Glue strength gradually declines with extended heating or repeated cooling and reheating. You can successfully reheat hide glue several times for non-critical work like gluing on dampers, back rail cloth, etc. (store covered in the refrigerator between uses). However, for high strength uses like wood working or hammer hanging, always mix it fresh. • Common lore is to mix the glue crystals with cold water only, then let it sit overnight before heating. I believe this is unnecessary and have always mixed and heated immediately with excellent results

- AlaskaGuy

Just goes to show you can’t believe everything you read. Either they are wrong or I am. I don’t know their source but mine is personal experience and being told this by Patrick Edwards who I believe above all others when it comes to animal glues.

-- Paul M ..............the early bird may get the worm but it’s the second mouse that gets the cheese! http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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