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View Tom622's profile

Parallel Clamps vs Bar Clamps

by Tom622
posted 11-01-2018 07:28 PM


24 replies so far

View ShaneA's profile

ShaneA

7084 posts in 3078 days


#1 posted 11-01-2018 07:32 PM

Square pressure, larger faces, more clamping force, they can “stand up” on their own. I prefer parallel clamps, but they are certainly more expensive and a bit more fussy to use from time to time. Weigh a bit more too.

View HokieKen's profile

HokieKen

10746 posts in 1618 days


#2 posted 11-01-2018 07:49 PM

What Shane said^^ When you need them, parallel clamps are the cat’s pajamas. But, when you don’t necessarily need the parallel faces and all that force, bar clamps are a little easier to manage sometimes. If I were restricted to only one type, it would be parallels for sure. But I’m glad I have both and I use both regularly.

-- Kenny, SW VA, Go Hokies!!!

View pottz's profile

pottz

5970 posts in 1464 days


#3 posted 11-01-2018 07:58 PM

as said one big difference is the cost,id love to have a wall full of em but ive always made do with pipe clamps.in 40 years wood working ive never had a problem getting the job done.so if cost is an issue the cheaper version will work just fine.

-- sawdust the bigger the pile the bigger my smile-larry,so cal.

View JayT's profile

JayT

6272 posts in 2691 days


#4 posted 11-01-2018 08:00 PM

What those guys ^^ said.

Parallel clamps are superior for all the reasons Shane mentioned and, like Kenny, if I could only have one, it would be parallel clamps. I use them the most and to start glueups and support with the less expesive bar clamps.

-- https://www.jtplaneworks.com - In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice, there is.

View Andybb's profile

Andybb

2026 posts in 1083 days


#5 posted 11-01-2018 08:05 PM

+1
Parallel = Festool
Bar Clamps = Dewalt

Both will get the job done 99% of the time.

-- Andy - Seattle USA

View WoodenDreams's profile

WoodenDreams

707 posts in 390 days


#6 posted 11-01-2018 08:06 PM

I use primarily my 24”,36” & 48” aluminum U-bar clamps when gluing up panels & chests, I switched from pipe clamps to aluminum U-clamps because it’s easier to use a lighter weight clamp. I also use F-clamps, and Irwin hand clamps. I have about (45) 24” thru 48” U-bar clamps, (6) 4’ pipe clamps, about (50) 6” thru 36” F-clamps, about (40) 6” thru 36” Irwin hand clamps, plus another (30) specialty clamps. I still run out of clamps on some of my glue-up projects. You never have enough clamps. What you’re clamping will determine the size & type of the clamp needed. Six of my aluminum U-bars clamps are parallel style, and I used them maybe twice in the last year.

View therealSteveN's profile

therealSteveN

3611 posts in 1054 days


#7 posted 11-01-2018 08:12 PM

Clamping pressure in a nutshell. Parallel clamps go out to around 1000 pounds, for most are slightly harder to work with, and for all are more money.

Other bar clamps, and pipe clamps about half the pressure, but they still exert plenty of pressure to make for good solid glue ups. prices are all over the place, but always less than Parallel’s.

All have some pros and cons. I think for most it actually just comes down to $$$$$$$ Unless your Granddaddy…. Sir Clamps a Lot died and left you his stash then they are all good.

And it’s just a generalization when they say you can NEVER have enough clamps. I know a few guys who have passed that never mark, all I can say for certain is they are poor now. One guy will have glued up panels all over the place to where getting through his shop is difficult, and still has walls dripping with clamp money, go figure, he took it seriously.

My take on that discussion is before you get the glue bottle out, round up as many clamps as that glue up needs. If you have enough clamps left to continue, do so, if not stop and glue up. MOST glue ups only require an hour tops in a clamp, and they will be good as long as you don’t abuse them before 24 hours. It’s really hard to run out of clamps if you work with that thought in mind, and you start with half as many again, as the most complicated glue up that you can imagine. Heck if you have serious or complicated glue ups, doing dry fitting and tuning up parts will take an hour for the next glue up. If not you can move ahead in cutting, sanding or shaping parts for another project while you wait.

Make a few cutting boards, a nice beginners project, and fun for old timers too. It will give you an idea of using clamps, and the time they will be in use. Grow from that, and add clamps only when you see a real need.

-- Think safe, be safe

View pintodeluxe's profile

pintodeluxe

5975 posts in 3293 days


#8 posted 11-01-2018 08:16 PM

I have both, and it’s interesting to think about what projects I prefer one over the other.
For panel glueups I reach for the bar clamps. I alternate them top and bottom. The glue pops off the bar easier, and I just get better results using pipe clamps for large panels.

For case glueups and general clamping, I prefer parallel clamps. The biggest ones are not always the best. My favorite are actually the Bessey Revo Jr’s. I reach for those in the 24” length all the time.

-- Willie, Washington "If You Choose Not To Decide, You Still Have Made a Choice" - Rush

View 000's profile

000

2859 posts in 1379 days


#9 posted 11-01-2018 08:24 PM

Old school here.

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5338 posts in 2789 days


#10 posted 11-02-2018 12:16 AM

What’s the matter with all you. You know all you need is some “ALDER”

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Jared_S's profile

Jared_S

214 posts in 439 days


#11 posted 11-02-2018 12:28 AM

I think a clarification of terms is in order..

Typical Bar clamps are heavy steel clamps that top out around 7000lbs of force. Aluminum Bar clamps are a whole other animal.

I would also argue that pipe clamps have significantly more clamping pressure than parallel clamps by virtue of the screw driver sized handle vs the lever on a pipe clamps.

If you’re making large laminated benches or exterior doors Bar clamps are far superior to parallel clamps. So the idea of what is better depends on the application.

View DrDirt's profile

DrDirt

4592 posts in 4222 days


#12 posted 11-02-2018 04:47 AM


I think a clarification of terms is in order..

Typical Bar clamps are heavy steel clamps that top out around 7000lbs of force. Aluminum Bar clamps are a whole other animal.

- Jared_S


Thank you for beating me to that Jared – I have some of the Pony/Jorgenson I-beam Bar Clamps… and they are a real beast. the 7200 series.
there is a 3700 series, as the F style have 1000 pounds force which is great to press veneeer between platens, or to bend laminations to a form For those style, I got clamps from Menards, that are 10 bucks each for that application for 12 inch clamps
Menards MASTERFORCE-600 pounds of force

Jorgenson 3700s

Jorgenson 7200s – great for large panel glue ups… ZERO flex in that bar

-- “The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why.” Mark Twain

View WoodenDreams's profile

WoodenDreams

707 posts in 390 days


#13 posted 11-02-2018 06:39 AM

What your clamping will determine the size and clamp needed. Sounds like a few of the LJ’s like to squeeze out all of the glue from their glue-ups, with too much clamping pressure, leaving no glue in the joints. Parallel clamps do have a larger footprint, but are normally heavier to use. The aluminum U-bar clamps are lighter and easier to use because of the weight. I have not experienced them to bend while clamping. All of my aluminum U-bar clamps have a plastic cover on them to prevent glue from sticking to the clamps. So, for this reason I use the U-bar clamps more often.

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5338 posts in 2789 days


#14 posted 11-02-2018 08:10 AM

I think all this hooey about ton of pressure is overrated. A good rub joint will break the wood before the joint and there is no clamp presser at all . I’ll go with my parallel clamps most times. Most of us are not building huge glue lams you know.

https://youtu.be/H5fXUzIF0MU

I’ve done this and it works.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View WoodenDreams's profile

WoodenDreams

707 posts in 390 days


#15 posted 11-02-2018 06:19 PM

I agree with AlaskaGuy on the not needing much pressure on glue ups.

View DrDirt's profile

DrDirt

4592 posts in 4222 days


#16 posted 11-02-2018 08:58 PM


What your clamping will determine the size and clamp needed. Sounds like a few of the LJ s like to squeeze out all of the glue from their glue-ups, with too much clamping pressure, leaving no glue in the joints.
- WoodenDreams

Alaskaguy is right, that you can do a rub joint that is stronger than the wood (assuming the joinery is good).. though you end up with a thicker glueline.

The heavy bar clamps allows you to use a smaller number of clamps, exerting the same pressure at the glueline. e.g. 3 “higher pressure clamps” versus 5 medium pressure clamps, is the same pressure at the joint.
As an example vacuum bagging is only 14 psi. But if you are laminating at 12×12 panel… that is over 2000 pounds of pressure on that square foot… but only 14 psi. (14 psi x 144 sq in =2016 pounds force)... lest you think veneer is glue starved??

This is particularly important when gluing a large panel, like a tabletop, as bar deflection is a bigger issue. The pressure needed to starve a joint is larger than what the wood can withstand at the clamping point. So if you are not crushing dents right into the workpiece through the caul. Starvation is an old wives tale from a practical matter.

Most “starvation stories” are in Mortice and Tennon joints, where someone has a tennon they have to pound in with a mallet, effectively ‘Scraping all the glue off the surface, to the bottom of the mortice’ while driving that piston into the cylinder – which is totally different than and not from “Squeezeing the glue out of a joint” with a clam

-- “The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why.” Mark Twain

View Jared_S's profile

Jared_S

214 posts in 439 days


#17 posted 11-02-2018 10:32 PM


As an example vacuum bagging is only 14 psi. But if you are laminating at 12×12 panel… that is over 2000 pounds of pressure on that square foot… but only 14 psi. (14 psi x 144 sq in =2016 pounds force)... lest you think veneer is glue starved??

This is particularly important when gluing a large panel, like a tabletop, as bar deflection is a bigger issue. The pressure needed to starve a joint is larger than what the wood can withstand at the clamping point. So if you are not crushing dents right into the workpiece through the caul. Starvation is an old wives tale from a practical matter.

- DrDirt

This…

And directly from the titebond literature..
http://titebond.com/product/glues/2ef3e95d-48d2-43bc-8e1b-217a38930fa2

REQUIRED CLAMPING PRESSURE:
Enough to bring joints tightly together (generally, 100-150 psi for softwoods, 125-175 psi for medium woods and 175-250 psi for hardwoods)

Using their own numbers a 6’ edge glueup at 1.375” thick would be 14000lbs required pressure for hardwoods on the low end.. and that’s just the optimum pressure.

View lumbering_on's profile

lumbering_on

578 posts in 970 days


#18 posted 11-02-2018 11:04 PM

The best to go with are actually 4-way clamps, but they are expensive. Easy to setup and your clamping pressure will automatically be applied parallel to the gluing surface as well as perpendicular. This means you never have to worry about having to use cauls.

Personally, I use the pipe clamps as you can vary the length by just changing out the pipes, and when use with cauls, they produce a great result. The are also much cheaper than parallel clamps. True, some people find the older pipe clamps a bit hard to setup, but the newer pipe clamps are easy as they have feet on them. You can also make a clamping rack which makes things go very quickly.

In the end, any clamps will work, it’s really just a matter of preference, which includes your budget.

View MSquared's profile

MSquared

670 posts in 394 days


#19 posted 11-03-2018 01:20 AM

AlaskaGuy; one day I’ll catch on to why you seem to throw a reference to “Alder” in there to some of the posts.

-- Marty, Long Island, NY

View pottz's profile

pottz

5970 posts in 1464 days


#20 posted 11-03-2018 03:24 AM



The best to go with are actually 4-way clamps, but they are expensive. Easy to setup and your clamping pressure will automatically be applied parallel to the gluing surface as well as perpendicular. This means you never have to worry about having to use cauls.

Personally, I use the pipe clamps as you can vary the length by just changing out the pipes, and when use with cauls, they produce a great result. The are also much cheaper than parallel clamps. True, some people find the older pipe clamps a bit hard to setup, but the newer pipe clamps are easy as they have feet on them. You can also make a clamping rack which makes things go very quickly.

In the end, any clamps will work, it s really just a matter of preference, which includes your budget.

- lumbering_on


ditto,no need to spend 50 bucks for a clamp,anything that puts pressure between two objects is a clamp,enough said!

-- sawdust the bigger the pile the bigger my smile-larry,so cal.

View pottz's profile

pottz

5970 posts in 1464 days


#21 posted 11-03-2018 03:25 AM



AlaskaGuy; one day I ll catch on to why you seem to throw a reference to “Alder” in there to some of the posts.

- MSquared


oh don’t get him started-lol.

-- sawdust the bigger the pile the bigger my smile-larry,so cal.

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5338 posts in 2789 days


#22 posted 11-03-2018 03:36 AM


AlaskaGuy; one day I ll catch on to why you seem to throw a reference to “Alder” in there to some of the posts.

- MSquared


39 post in 74 days. No wonder you asked. Stick around and read the new post everyday and it will be come apparent to you. I think you’ll find there are a couple others who use “Alder” more than I do. Rome wasn’t built in 39 days. Just hang in there and you’ll find out.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

View Rich's profile

Rich

4812 posts in 1069 days


#23 posted 11-03-2018 03:54 AM

AlaskaGuy; one day I ll catch on to why you seem to throw a reference to “Alder” in there to some of the posts.

- MSquared

39 post in 74 days. No wonder you asked. Stick around and read the new post everyday and it will be come apparent to you. I think you ll find there are a couple others who use “Alder” more than I do. Rome wasn t built in 39 days. Just hang in there and you ll find out.

- AlaskaGuy

So young and naive. Adler clamps are also known as Chuck Norris clamps. I once glued up a 24” panel, and after applying the alder clamps, it was only 15”.

-- There's no such thing as a careless electrician

View AlaskaGuy's profile

AlaskaGuy

5338 posts in 2789 days


#24 posted 11-03-2018 04:00 AM

So young and naive. Adler clamps are also known as Chuck Norris clamps. I once glued up a 24” panel, and after applying the alder clamps, it was only 15”.

- Rich

Yep, got to watch what you are doing when you use those Norris clamps.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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