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View 8892's profile

Black and Decker Firestorm FS2500TS 10"

by 8892
posted 02-11-2018 05:42 PM


28 replies so far

View MrUnix's profile

MrUnix

7468 posts in 2679 days


#1 posted 02-11-2018 05:57 PM

Keep looking.

The B&D is a universal screamer motor thing that isn’t much of an upgrade from what you already have, and that jet sold new for around $400 ($399.99) IIRC.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View Bill White's profile

Bill White

5225 posts in 4440 days


#2 posted 02-11-2018 06:18 PM

You don’t want that B & D saw.
Bill

-- [email protected]

View Holt's profile

Holt

280 posts in 3109 days


#3 posted 02-11-2018 06:32 PM

I haven’t looked in your area, but in the B’ham, AL area CL, I turned up about 6 table saws from $50 to $250 that I would buy over anything labeled B&D. I would think looking for a few days should turn up an old craftsman for about the same money…

-- ...Specialization is for insects.

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#4 posted 02-11-2018 07:21 PM

I live in Omaha, NE area and honestly finding a good used table saw has been a struggle. And I don’t want to pay 500+ for a new saw lol.

By the way, I didn’t know that jet was sold new for $400.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#5 posted 02-11-2018 09:01 PM

What matters is condition and fence quality. Go look at the Jet and see if you can talk him down.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View MrUnix's profile

MrUnix

7468 posts in 2679 days


#6 posted 02-11-2018 09:31 PM

You live near a major city, so I’m sure deals come and go pretty quick. Just a quick scan turned up a few that were worth looking at, such as this US Made Delta 34-444 contractor saw for $125. Motor has an issue, so I bet you could get them to go even lower – maybe offer $50-$75 and use the cost of a motor replacement as a negotiation point. It’s been out there for a couple of weeks, so they will probably be open to any reasonable offer. However – from the pictures, I can almost guarantee it’s just a bad capacitor, which will set you back about $10 to fix :)

Cheers,
Brad

PS: Can’t tell from the photo, but that saw -might- be one of the magical ones that are 1.5hp on 120v, but 2hp on 240v :)

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#7 posted 02-11-2018 09:46 PM

Thanks Brad. I’ll try to contact that person. How do you replace capacitor?

View MrUnix's profile

MrUnix

7468 posts in 2679 days


#8 posted 02-11-2018 10:24 PM

Thanks Brad. I ll try to contact that person. How do you replace capacitor?
- 8892

Unplug old one, plug in new one – should have spade connectors on them:

I’d test them first, which is super easy to do with a multimeter in resistance mode. Looks like the owner has already been messing with them as they have already been taken out from under their covers. Should be a simple fix, and even if it’s not a capacitor, 99.9% of the time it’s just something really stupid simple.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

8325 posts in 3856 days


#9 posted 02-11-2018 10:31 PM

Skip the B&D. The Jet is a decent basic contractor and looks to have cast iron wings. $350 is more than I’d want to pay, but is worth a look and an offer if it checks out.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#10 posted 02-11-2018 10:41 PM

Thanks knotscott.

I just reached out to that Delta saw seller and looks like someone bought it already.

I saw that a week or so ago but with non-working status, I was a little hesitant.

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

8325 posts in 3856 days


#11 posted 02-12-2018 12:25 AM

It looked like there was a Craftsman contractor saw with the upgraded fence, but no wings. IIRC they were asking $250, but an offer $150ish would be fair IMO if it runs well.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#12 posted 02-12-2018 01:07 AM

Wings are no big deal, the fence is a big deal. Don’t buy a saw like that Delta where youll need to make a bunch of repairs and replace the fence or you’ll be $350 into it in no time, and spend weeks repairing and replacing parts. Buy a saw with a good fence that’s mostly ready to go. Don’t fret over a few bucks or what the saw sold for. What does a Jet contractor sell for now?

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View JAAune's profile

JAAune

1866 posts in 2797 days


#13 posted 02-12-2018 01:34 AM

If you’re in the Chicago area I’ve got two Grizzly contractor saws that I will be posting for sale soon. One has an Incra fence and the other has an old Biesemeyer. They’re not fancy saws, but with good fences they can handle most jobs easily enough. I’ve retired them in favor of an old Minimax and a future purchase of a Sawstop.

-- See my work at http://remmertstudios.com and http://altaredesign.com

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#14 posted 02-12-2018 02:49 AM

Thanks guys. Yea I’m keeping my eyes out. What’s a good old craftman saw? The reason I ask is cause there’s so many “models” that craftman made back in the days and kinda a pain. Is there like a “to look for” for an old craftman table saw?

I have an old 1” belt and 8” disc Sanders and belt sander from craftman and love them both. Of course they were built to last.

I live in Omaha,NE – kinda a far drive from IL.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#15 posted 02-12-2018 02:52 AM

I wanted to clarify that buying a fixer upper saw is perfectly fine if you enjoy fixing up machines. I do and others do, but some people want to plug in and go. And it’s worth being aware that if you buy a saw with a crappy fence that you’ll probably be dropping another $200 for a replacement so if you can buy a saw with a good fence then you’re ahead of the game.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View ArtMann's profile

ArtMann

1425 posts in 1296 days


#16 posted 02-12-2018 03:00 AM

It didn’t!


I live in Omaha, NE area and honestly finding a good used table saw has been a struggle. And I don t want to pay 500+ for a new saw lol.

By the way, I didn t know that jet was sold new for $400.

- 8892


View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#17 posted 02-12-2018 03:19 AM

I thought someone said it did. My bad.


It didn t!

I live in Omaha, NE area and honestly finding a good used table saw has been a struggle. And I don t want to pay 500+ for a new saw lol.

By the way, I didn t know that jet was sold new for $400.

- 8892

- ArtMann


View IantheTinker's profile

IantheTinker

285 posts in 607 days


#18 posted 02-12-2018 03:32 AM

Get a Saw with a good fence and decent motor, you likely want to get right into building projects, not spend the next few weeks replacing parts and blowing money. Take a few days or more to look through craigslist, a good deal I saw worth a little drive, but don’t be in a rush. You already have a saw, you don’t have to be a beggar, be a chooser…and choose carefully.

I would bypass both of these saws and hold out for something less expensive and with a decent fence.

-- pensivewoodworker.com

View MrUnix's profile

MrUnix

7468 posts in 2679 days


#19 posted 02-12-2018 03:55 AM

By the way, I didn t know that jet was sold new for $400.
It didn t!
- ArtMann

That saw was made in 1991, and unfortunately, the wayback machine doesn’t index back that far – however, here is a wayback machine snapshot of the Rockler web site from 2007 showing the same saw, but with an upgraded fence:


https://web.archive.org/web/20071216012557/http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=17903
(and here is a rec.woodworking newsgroup entry saying the same)

Says it’s on sale, and claims it was normally $699 – but even at that price, the guy is asking half the price of a new saw for one that is almost 30 years old.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#20 posted 02-12-2018 05:27 AM

I’m going from memory but I’m pretty sure that normal retail on the Jet was $600+. But it doesn’t matter what it sold for in 1991, it only matters what someone in Omaha is willing to pay now. Jet was importing good quality Taiwan machines. The fence wasn’t as strong as a Bies or Unifence, but was usable. It wouldn’t hurt to go look at the saw and see if the guy is flexible on the price. I’ve found that a lot of people get very flexible when you wave cash. Or wait. Tomorrow or next week or next month might bring a better deal. But if it were me, I would save up the money and buy a new (or lightly used) saw that is exactly what you want even if it meant waiting a year or so save the money. Buy once, cry once.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#21 posted 02-13-2018 01:56 PM

Someone mentioned craftman contractor saw. What you guys think of this one?

https://lincoln.craigslist.org/tls/d/selling-10-inch-craftsman/6493236782.html

Also, I’m looking jet table saw today. . Sounds like the seller is getting very desperate for cash. Hmm.. I’m gonna try to offer 250.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#22 posted 02-13-2018 05:13 PM

I’ve never owned one but people speak well of them. The fence is a John Heisz design and superior to the original. Again, something I haven’t used but feedback on them is positive. I would worry about saw vibration. He’s asking $200 but inviting offers. I bet if you stuck out your hand with $150 in cash, he would take it. But the Jet at $250 is enticing.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#23 posted 02-13-2018 05:59 PM

Yea I offered the guy 140 and he said he wouldn’t go lower than 180. Then why say “OBO”? He said he’s upgrading to a bigger table saw but sometimes about his tone on the phone makes me very curious. Since it’s new to posting I’ll wait.

Yea I’ve been following that (not stalking) on that Jet table saw. Looks like it’s her late father’s saw but she’s in need of cash and doesn’t look to be emotionally attached to it. It was first listed at 400, then to 375, and now 350 – within like 4 days. So I think if I offer 250, maybe we can close it at 270-280, assuming arbor, fence, motors, etc. Checks out.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#24 posted 02-13-2018 06:56 PM

I recommend only making your offers in person. 99.99999% of the people who make offers over the phone or email, never show up, they are time wasters so I reject them out of hand. Most people who make an appointment, never show up. So when someone actually stands in front of me and makes an offer, I take it seriously, but not before. And when buying, I like to discuss money last. Decide if I want it and at the end stick out my hand and make the lower offer. Once in awhile you run into a tough negotiator but you have set your price and not exceed it. But I never let a couple bucks get between me and a piece of equipment that I want to own. In ten years, I’m not going to remember if I paid $50 too much.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#25 posted 02-13-2018 07:33 PM

Very interesting, Rick. I’ve always talked about price before even looking at some item, mind you a lot of items were small tools. I think the only big item that I negotiated over is a PC 14” bandsaw. I think I got it for like 300? I don’t remember the price now as u stated but I love the bandsaw and use it for almost anything I can’t cut on the table saw.

I thought JETs we’re good table saw but I guess they are mid-tiers. I’m sure this will come down to whether I really want it and whether it’d be ideal in my garage.

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

12890 posts in 2860 days


#26 posted 02-13-2018 08:10 PM

Sears bought machines from manufacturers and put their label on the package, so quality varied depending on who made what and how much effort went into quality control. Jet started as an importer of Taiwan made machines, back in the 60’s I think, when most machinery was still American made. For a long time Jet didn’t even rebadge the machines so you see a lot of 70’s drill presses with brand names you’ve never heard of but they are all alike and were probably all imported by Jet. They gained ground through good customer service, good quality control, and just all around good machinery. Jet, like Delta and Powermatic, have been sold several times and I think their machines are now made on the Chinese mainland. I think most of Jet’s business is now bigger machinery and Grizzly has taken their place among hobbyists. Grizzly basically used the same business model but imported cheaper Chinese made machinery with poor quality control but really good customer service. Quality control is one of the most expensive phases of manufacturing and that’s why companies try to skimp or automate the process as much as possible.

As for negotiating, everyone has their own techniques. But as a seller, I don’t bother with people who make phone or email offers anymore because they ask a million questions, make an offer and you never see or hear from them again. Or occasionally you’ll hear from them a lot, as they make excuses on why they can’t get there today but will come tomorrow. Matter of fact, I only respond to phone calls anymore and won’t even include an email. So if they make an offer sight unseen, I just turn it down. One guy wanted to know why and I told him, because you’ll never show up. He got angry, said that he was a man of his word and that if he said he would show up then by god he would show up. He never showed up.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View 8892's profile

8892

11 posts in 585 days


#27 posted 03-02-2018 09:43 PM

So just an update in case anyone wanna know,. I went to see the JET and I was not impressed at all. Blade was wobbly even when I put on a new blade that I brought with me.

And of course I passed on the B&D.

After a few days of searching through, I found a craftman 113 for $185 with minimal use that owner claim but from the pictures, it didn’t look minimal. It was about 100 miles drive.

Then a Hitachi C10LF showed up on CL late at night. The guy was selling it for $100. I reached out to him and I was a little hesitant because of the condition. See picture

Then I went to look at it after reading some mix reviews but positive overall for $500 TS. It had some rust that I can clean quickly and latex paint that I’ll figure out a way to clean. The paint didn’t get inside the motor housing.

The guy cut vinyl planks that are 5-7mm and there is very minimal play to the blade, all the adjustments and even though fence (though it looks a little rough) works very good. There’s 2 miters so I got them though I’ll probably not use it much. Motor was quiet and smooth. He said he’s moving out of state so he’s selling it. I pulled the trigger and paid him $5 extra to deliver it to my house.

Does anyone know what’s a good way to take off the paint? Paint thinners? Also, the guy doesn’t care about safety so riving knife isn’t available on him.

View JBeaver's profile

JBeaver

1 post in 241 days


#28 posted 01-20-2019 09:59 PM

I realize this is an old post but for those searching in the future about info on B&D FS2500TS I have had mine since 2004 when I purchased it new for about $500.00 It has been a beast, and I mean that in a good way. I have had many trades people use it while on many different job sites and always get the same response. Is it for sale? The answer is always NO! It is bulky and we flip it on its end onto a dolly to move it as I’ve never found a portable table for it or taken the time to figure one out. It’s large scale legs keep it completely stable and they are even adjustable even though with all the abuses it’s taken it hasn’t needed to have them adjusted. The motor powerful, it cuts smoothly and I will trade the bulkyness of transporting it to have the power and stability of it any day. I use it in my business when remodeling kitchens and baths to cut filler for cabinets as well as a myriad of cuts on furniture grade plywood and hardwood for cabinets and bookcases etc. when a perfect cut is required for finish work it can’t be beat. I will say when I purchased it, I needed a saw, didn’t have a lot of time to look and took a risk but it’s one I’ve never regretted. I usually prefer pro grade tools but this one has been a great tool that has earned its weight for me.

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