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calling all Harbor Freighters - dust collector stock question

by jamsomito
posted 02-03-2018 03:39 PM


27 replies so far

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#1 posted 02-03-2018 04:25 PM

Ok, so most of my research was between the oldest one and the newer (at the time) #97869. Looks like people are generally satisfied with the newest gray #61790, and there have never been any motor nameplates to actually confirm motor power on either just that the manual says 20A peak and the new one had a sticker on the drum that says 14A. Maybe it was a change, maybe not. Still, I’m going to be modifying this unit and it would be nice to know if I can still get the #97869.

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AZWoody

1461 posts in 1757 days


#2 posted 02-03-2018 04:32 PM

If I remember correctly, my green one may have said 20 amp but it really only drew around 13.
The grey one isn’t any less powerful, it’s just now showing a more realistic power draw.

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#3 posted 02-03-2018 04:32 PM



If I remember correctly, my green one may have said 20 amp but it really only drew around 13.
The grey one isn t any less powerful, it s just now showing a more realistic power draw.

- AZWoody

Interesting, thanks for that.

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Carl10

115 posts in 990 days


#4 posted 02-03-2018 05:04 PM

Since you are aware of the impeller discussion, then as Woody stated the motor may indeed be smaller than other units since it never used the extra HP. The question is would you ever consider the 12” upgrade in your path? If so the 15A motor probably would not cut it as I believe the 12” impeller pushes pretty close to the 20A current limit.

The other option to check is there are any on Craigslist. In my area there are a steady stream of those and other 1.5HP DCs for sale. The HF units are usually ~$100-125.

Hope that helps. Let us know what you do.

Carl

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#5 posted 02-03-2018 05:08 PM

Yes, the 12” impeller would be on the future upgrade list… after the cartridge filter and a separator. But yes this is why I’m concerned about making sure to get the bigger motor.

Interestingly, doing the math P=V*A, and converting 0.746kW/HP, I’m getting 2HP = 12.43A @ 120V, so the 13A number makes sense. Maybe the 20A rating on the older green model was some sort of peak as it was labeled, obviously consuming more at startup. This is assuming input power, not accounting for motor efficiency or fan efficiency (or load factor). Throw in motor efficiency and you’re up around 15-16A input for 2HP mechanical power. So maybe the unit labeled 15A is still about the same size and it was just a labeling change.

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WhyMe

1182 posts in 2094 days


#6 posted 02-03-2018 05:14 PM

I have an older one that was listed 20A, but the real life draw was 13A based on my amp meter. May be they are now listing it as 15A to be more accurate. They still list the HP and air flow the same. I’d get the gray one and not worry about it.

Edit: By the way on start-up my amp meter goes to about 70A for about a second.

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#7 posted 02-03-2018 05:16 PM

I’m leaning that way.

Does anyone know if the new gray one would take the same impeller as the old green one? Not sure if that would affect my future upgrades any…

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#8 posted 02-03-2018 05:21 PM

According to this guy’s mod writeup, it fits the same. http://www.beaubilt.com/2017/08/11/larger-impeller-harbor-freight-dust-collector/

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MT_Stringer

3183 posts in 3764 days


#9 posted 02-03-2018 05:26 PM

Just a quick two cents worth. I have the green model purchased several years ago. It would not run on a regular 15amp 110 volt circuit. I had an electrician run a dedicated 20amp circuit and it has performed great ever since.

I modified the DC by mounting it on the wall, switching to a Wynn Env. Filter, and built a Thein inspired knock out separator, which works great. Well until it fills up and I forget too check the level!


-- Handcrafted by Mike Henderson - Channelview, Texas

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#10 posted 02-03-2018 05:45 PM

See, this is what makes me hesitate, haha.

I have a 20A circuit it can run on so no issues there.

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#11 posted 02-03-2018 06:59 PM

Looking at prices, it’s about a $15 difference after various discounts and shipping charges between buying the collector in the store and a hose from HF online, or just buying them both online with the chance of getting a #97869 20A variant.

I can eat $15 if there’s a good chance I’d get the older, higher amperage model. My question is, do you think they would ship me one, or would I get the newer 15A version? If there’s a high likelihood of the latter, I’d probably save the cash and just go get it at the store.

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#12 posted 02-03-2018 07:12 PM

Ok, I figured a discount place like this would have bad customer support, but I called the number on their website anyway (Saturday right now) and to my surprise someone actually picked up. I explained the situation and she confirmed they actually have a stock of about 800 of the old green #97869, and this is indeed the model that would be shipped to me if I were to order it online. So, that’s what I’m going to do.

DC: https://www.harborfreight.com/2-hp-industrial-5-micron-dust-collector-97869.html
hose: https://www.harborfreight.com/4-inch-x-10-ft-transparent-dust-collector-hose-96478.html

Total after coupons and discount: $201.92

Honestly, $20 shipping on 100lbs is not a bad deal. Bummed I couldn’t get it in store, but glad I could find the right model I was after.

I will keep you all posted as to which model actually shows up when it gets here… fingers crossed.

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#13 posted 02-03-2018 07:16 PM

Forgot to say, thanks for the used suggestion – I looked around here on both craigslist and facebook marketplace and all I could find were suitable units that were 800% overpriced, or ancient stuff I didn’t want to mess with, so back to the new option it was.

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jamsomito

433 posts in 959 days


#14 posted 02-09-2018 03:18 PM

Whelp, box showed up today and at first I thought I got the new gray one, but it shows model number #97869, and the base reflects the solid base of this model and not the tubular base of the newer #61790. Time to do some assembly and we’ll see what I really got… Maybe they’re just merging the two now using parts interchangeably.

View Vintage75's profile

Vintage75

11 posts in 1214 days


#15 posted 03-19-2019 11:43 PM

I am in the same predicament as jamsomito with some confusion about the two dust collectors. I went to my local harbor freight today, bought what I thought was the “green” model. Although the box had the proper model #97869, I couldn’t find anything on the box stating the motor was 20 amps. Then, upon opening the box, I noticed the color of the unit was grey! It did have the solid base, though. However, I could not verify the 20 amp rating anywhere on the unit itself. Has anyone had this same experience? Has the shift been made to all 15 amp grey units now, no matter the item number (97869 or 61790)? Second question: has anyone upgraded to the rikon impeller with the 15 amp unit? Can it handle the load?

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WoodenDreams

790 posts in 444 days


#16 posted 03-20-2019 03:20 AM

If you got the 1550cfm model. then it doesn’t matter if it’s 15amp or 20amp. if the projected cfm is the same for each.

View HackFabrication's profile

HackFabrication

159 posts in 245 days


#17 posted 03-20-2019 12:59 PM

None of the stores within 200 miles of my house had any dust collectors in stock. I’m in the process of upgrading my HF DC that I purchased off CL for $100. It’s the gray model with the aluminum heat soak on the motor. https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/303647

Had I seen this thread before you pulled the trigger on the HF model, I would have given you a few monetary reasons not to go the upgrade route. But since you have it, and want to ‘tinker’ with it, my thread has a couple of ideas that you might want to look at.

I have no problems spinning the larger Rikon impeller with the motor. You will want to enlarge the intake on the blower housing to 6” to get maximum benefit from that upgrade.

-- "In the end, it's all Hack..."

View Vintage75's profile

Vintage75

11 posts in 1214 days


#18 posted 03-20-2019 01:24 PM

Thanks for the reply, Wooden. I talked to hf support and they let me know that the motor is not necessarily rated for 20 amps, but that it is meant for a 20 amp circuit, whereas the newer unit only requires a 15 amp circuit. I’m no electrician, but this suggests to me that the 20 amp version pulls more current at startup, but probably runs at about the same 13 amps as the other unit. Does that sound right? If so, I guess my only remaining concern is whether fewer startup amps would prevent a 15 amp unit from running the larger Rikon impeller.

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HackFabrication

159 posts in 245 days


#19 posted 03-20-2019 01:31 PM

Refer to my post: No problems starting or turning the Rikon impeller. But I’ve only tested it on a dedicate 20a circuit.

-- "In the end, it's all Hack..."

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Vintage75

11 posts in 1214 days


#20 posted 03-20-2019 01:41 PM

Thanks, Hack. I actually opened the box in the parking lot. My hesitation told me it was better to return it until I knew for sure what I was getting. So here I am putting in a bit more research! I’ll check out your link, too. Good to hear you’ve had some luck with the aftermarket impeller. I generally avoid harbor freight at all costs, but the great reviews of this unit got me hooked (that and not wanting to spend $700). I’ve already built a cart and thein baffle for my previous collector from scraps/parts I had on hand, so that’s water under the bridge now. I also would only have it hooked to my table saw or bandsaw directly, so it seems like it could suit my needs in my small 1-car garage shop. If you could go back and do it over again, would you go with a different unit? I’ve heard good things about some of the smaller Grizzly units.

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richimage

45 posts in 2264 days


#21 posted 03-20-2019 03:19 PM

I modified my CL unit a couple of years ago ( Rikon impeller, dust expelled outside, ceiling mount) and after this discussion, I think I’m just going to paint it Blue (AF Blue) and recommend any modified units do the same thing. It could be the “next big thing”!

-- "Women are like modern paintings. You can't enjoy them if you try to understand them." Farrokh Bulsara (Freddie Mercury)

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HackFabrication

159 posts in 245 days


#22 posted 03-21-2019 12:06 AM


If you could go back and do it over again, would you go with a different unit? I’ve heard good things about some of the smaller Grizzly units.

- Vintage75


Probably not. I could afford the complete units, but I like tinkering with ‘stuff’, so this particular project has been fun (unlike a few of my other projects).

I think this 3hp Grizzly: https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-3-HP-Portable-Cyclone-Dust-Collector/G0862 for $1295 + $119 shipping, is what I would have gone with, had I not decided to go the modded HF route. A lot of bang for the buck. But it would be extreme overkill for my basement workshop, and about $400 more than what I’ll have into my HF/Rikon/SDD system. Now their 1.5hp at $699 + $119 shipping: https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-1-1-2-HP-Portable-Cyclone-Dust-Collector/G0860 is where you start to begin thinking ‘Maybe I should’ve just…’.

-- "In the end, it's all Hack..."

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Phsntdawg70

3 posts in 243 days


#23 posted 03-21-2019 04:28 AM

Does your new DC actually have a nameplate on the motor? My gray HF DC doesn’t have a nameplate. Checking the website does show the difference on the 15 amp draw for the gray model versus the 20 amp draw for the green model. However both are listed at 2hp with a 1550 cfm airflow. Is there any way to verify that the gray model is actually a 2hp motor? I would also like to know if anyone has done an actual airflow test to verify that the Rikon impeller develops more cfm when installed in a HF DC? The Rikon 2hp DC is listed as developing 1250cfm airflow so is everyone just assuming that the larger diameter impeller moves more air or has it been proven? The specs show 300cfm less airflow.

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HackFabrication

159 posts in 245 days


#24 posted 03-21-2019 08:24 AM

I would also like to know if anyone has done an actual airflow test to verify that the Rikon impeller develops more cfm when installed in a HF DC?
- Phsntdawg70

When I was researching this, there are a number of internet posts, on various forums and YouTube showing the increase. Didn’t save any of the links, but a simple search will pop up a lot.

The Rikon impeller has the vanes angled in the reverse direction of the HF’s. And it’s 1” larger in diameter: 10 7/8” vs 9 7/8”. Check my thread https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/303647 for pics of the two.

According to my research, and if IIRC, this reverse vane design, helps maintain airflow volume as static pressure increases. Where as the HF’s design provides a lot of airflow, but diminishes as SP increases. I’m certain someone with a better memory than me, will chime in and correct this if wrong. But yes, the numbers are out there.

I didn’t check the airflow at the impeller housing before installing the Rikon impeller. But my simple ‘hand’ check told me that there was a lot more air getting sucked through the housing.

-- "In the end, it's all Hack..."

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Vintage75

11 posts in 1214 days


#25 posted 03-21-2019 12:13 PM



I would also like to know if anyone has done an actual airflow test to verify that the Rikon impeller develops more cfm when installed in a HF DC? The Rikon 2hp DC is listed as developing 1250cfm airflow so is everyone just assuming that the larger diameter impeller moves more air or has it been proven? The specs show 300cfm less airflow.

- Phsntdawg70

As far as I can tell, there have never been nameplates on the hf units. The tech I talked to the other day told me that there should be a sticker near the on/off switch that states 15 or 20 amps. I didn’t see one on the unit I was looking at, but I could have missed it. Here’s some information that may help answer your airflow question.

www.woodtalkonline.com/topic/23656-harbor-freight-rikonstein-dc/

Scroll down to the video posted by Brent to see a nice modded DC project.

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them700project

170 posts in 1552 days


#26 posted 03-21-2019 02:49 PM

When i bought a few years ago I got the grey one. I had read that there was no difference at the time. and that the green one had an overrated amp draw.

I have a wynn filter and a oneida super dust deputy for grabs both lightly used

View ArtMann's profile

ArtMann

1441 posts in 1349 days


#27 posted 03-21-2019 03:21 PM

Current flow IS NOT an indicator of the actual power output of a motor. Cheaper motors are less efficient and waste more energy putting heat into the environment. In addition, the full load current listed on the motor tag may not be very accurate. What you are trying to do with that current rating is not really possible. Either motor could put out more power or they could both be the same.

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