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10K views 114 replies 54 participants last post by  oldnovice 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I have read a great number of postings on LJ by folks seeking plans to build this or that, but having no luck finding such. We have in our mind's eye an image of what we want, but cannot seem to find it on paper, anywhere. Of course not! The project doesn't exist. Even if we stumble upon a drawing that is similar; it will never be what we have in mind. Worst yet, the "plan" calls for equipment or tools we do not have, or perhaps skills not yet acquired.

A plan, in and of itself, is really nothing more than directions for how a thing is to be built, or a detailed record of how the thing was built. In regards to woodworking, a plan leads to the creation of a cut-list. Ultimately, the cut-list is what we seek. The cut-list answers two important questions. How much lumber do I need to acquire, or perhaps, do I have enough lumber on hand?

As a draftsman in the architectural casework and mill work industries for many years, I produced thousands upon thousands of shop drawings. From simple wall panel systems to the windows in the U.S. Capitol Building, from janitorial closet shelving to executive office furniture. With each and every one of these drawings came a cut-list. Although the drawings remained the same the cut-lists varied from shop to shop. As each shop employed different joinery techniques, they required their own unique cut-list.

For example: what is the length of part B?

Rectangle Slope Font Parallel Pattern


We cannot answer the question until we know what the joint between part A and part B will be. For instance, if we use dowels we need a piece 12" long, but if we make a through tenon we'll need a piece 15" long. Furthermore, if we make simple mortise and tenon joint, the length of the piece could be anywhere between 12" and 15", depending on the depth of the mortises. Not only do we need to know what joinery, we also need to know what tools are being employed. Are we cutting the parts with hand tools or precisely calibrated machines? Do we leave some waste on the ends to allow for squaring, and if so how much, or are we going to cut square to start with?

So, picture your project in your mind's eye. Think about the machines and/or tools at your disposal. Imagine all the parts and their placement within the project. Visualize the joinery between the parts. Then, based on the height, width, and depth of the project, determine the dimensions of the individual parts and create a cut-list.

Do you still think you need a plan?

All comments and/or questions welcomed.

EDIT: Please see the Newbie Challenge post #38 in the comments below, I hope those of you new to woodworking will give this a try.
 

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#3 ·
I find that I often suffer from "Analysis Paralysis", where I spend so much time trying to think of how to make something that I never actually get to the part where I start making it.

Alternatively, if I do start making it, the minute that the real project begins to deviate (and it always will) from the "perfect" design I had in my head, I get frustrated and discouraged.

It's taken a lot of time and a lot of self-reflection to figure out these things. Now, I usually make the project fit the materials I have, within reason. E.g. I look at whatever wood or sheet goods I have on hand and think "what does this want to become?"
 
#6 ·
+1 for the never used published plans. I just sketch out what my minds eye sees, and work from there. For parts I'm not sure of, I use construction material scraps. If it works I have a template, if not I make the changes needed and feed the scrap to my wood burner.

I'm sure that plans might make the process faster, but I am a hobby wood worker so it's all just time well spent in the shop to me.

I tried sketchup but I like to spend my limited free time in the shop rather than the office.
 
#7 ·
I like the plan, for me a 3-D rendering, to coexist with the cutlist. I don't make a separate cutlist, but rather jot the overall length and shoulder-to-shoulder length on the drawing. Since I am only designing for my own needs, it makes it really nice.

Add a few exploded joinery views, and it all makes sense.
I have always been in favor of a detailed plan.

Thanks
 
#11 ·
I think I may have used someone else's plans once I usually do a quick hand draw drawing if it's something I need to keep track of a number of measurements and details but most the time I just get a photo of something similar from my customers and their requirements and build it from there especially if it's something easy like a table or most case work. My students are always asking for plans or bringing in plans many of them have very poor joinery and designs and are not accurate. Places that have built the project themselves are much more reliable, places like Woodsmith.
 
#12 ·
The problem I have with cultists is that they assume that each piece is going to be cut individually out of a board of certain dimensions. But often, one may be buying or working with boards that may be much longer or wider or thicker than the plans require. So the problem becomes how to make use of this material in an efficient way-getting as many pieces out of the stock as possible, while avoiding waste. I realize some people can probably work this way with no difficulty, but my mind doesn't work like that. So I often make up the plan as I go (after either sketching it out, or with a simple project, planning in my head. Part of that mental process is rehearsing how I will make the individual parts, how to dimension them, and what kind of assembly steps are going to work best.

I become impatient with Fine Woodworking's step by step plans because they not only tell, but picture, steps that should be self evident. Ex. Measure for and cut the mortices; measure for and cut the tenons. Using appropriate clamps and glue, assemble the parts with the tenons pressed into the mortices. (Not a direct quote, obviously).

Well, duh. How else would you do it?
 
#13 · (Edited by Moderator)
Some projects I have taken on in the past were just too difficult or complex to build "by the seat of my pants". You have to have drawings anyway if you are designing for a customer from a photo or a verbal concept. It is just too risky for them to be able to say "that is not what I had in mind".

Sketchup has become so familiar to me that it is easier than developing enough details on envelopes or napkins.
 
#14 ·
Many woodworkers never really learned Woodworking, they learned how to use tools. I learned that projects are a collection of joints and that's where our education should begin. Traditional joinery accounts for wood movement. Once you understand how to connect the pieces you can build anything. Drawing a plan or sketch helps to save time and reduce waste while allowing design tweaks before bringing blade to wood.
 
#15 ·
I found myself unable to design the top (main part) of my C-top roll top desk using ordinary methods. The only way I could do it, making sure I had dimensions for the panels right, for example, was to draw it out full size. I then worked from that full size drawing. Even used it as an assembly guide.
 
#16 ·
Never built anything from published plans … most of my plans are drawn on the back of an envelope or napkin and evolve over the life of the project as needed.

Cheers,
Brad

- MrUnix
Have to admit I have alot of such drawings laying around the shop. Plans are great and for those that like working with them, more power to ya. Me, the napkin does great and I have had no complaints from anyone I made something for…. LOL. YET.
 
#18 · (Edited by Moderator)
Once I have nailed down a particular design in my head, having visualized all the pieces, I like to put pen to paper, or cursor to screen. I like to use MSPaint, as I am free to do whatever I want, and it's free!

I'll draw simple elevations (side and front) and a plan view of what's in my head. I use the largest square under the BRUSH tab to establish the scale of my drawing. Sometimes this is an inch, sometimes the square is a 1/16th of an inch. It all depends on how detailed I need to be. You should give this a try … it's a lot of fun! Anyway, once drawn I isolate each part to be laid out on the drawings of the material to be used … rotating and moving around to get the best use of the material.

This is the drawing used for my Arts and Crafts Style Prie Dieu build:

Product Rectangle Font Parallel Pattern


I milled the black oak and hackberry boards to the required dimensions with finished edges on both sides. Once I had the parts placed where they needed to be … I simply went to town cutting them out!
 

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#20 ·
Most of the time, my plans are rough sketches and overall dimensions on a 3×5 card or post-it note. when I do need a little more detail, graph paper. My wife's idea of a plan is a picture of a portion of the item. I've built a couple of things from purchased and downloaded plans. None of them escaped modification. Sometimes it was to change the size, others, to change the joinery, sometimes, to match the stock I have on hand.

Where I have spent some time is on cut lists. The wife wanted interior shutters for the house. Need to shutter 6 sets of sliders and 4 windows. Went with bi-fold design and 3 panels for each, all pegged mortise and tenon joinery. With 360 pieces to keep straight, I spent hours coming up with cut lists and color coded tags to attach to each piece (stapled to end).
 
#21 ·
This is an interesting thread. I'm not sure it's particularly relevant, but my 7-y/o son was putting some Legos together, following the instructions for a new set from Christmas. He does pretty good with them on his own but occasionally runs into trouble and needs help. Most often the trouble is that he's deviated from the instructions slightly-placing a piece one block over, for example-and he then gets upset that he can't complete the instructions as they've been laid out. Sometimes it's a mistake and he needs help to figure out what went wrong and correct. it. Lately, however, it's more common that he says he decided this piece would instead be better over in this spot. That's fine! I tell him that it's ok and fun to deviate from the instructions, but he needs to understand that everything else won't fit as the instructions say.

Some rough plans are always good; polished plans are definitely better. Not worrying about following either of those precisely is best. You've got to roll with the work and be ready to adapt! At least for me, the benefit is recognizing how something may better fit for you (perhaps stretching a bookcase width to fill an area you have available) or adapting to a mistake. And, let me tell you, those adaptations from mistakes are very common for me!
 
#22 ·
Like so many things, this probably comes down to a personal preference for the average hobbyist/craftsman. Some projects are simple enough to not require anything on paper. Others, though more complicated, are viewed in the mind's eye by knowledgable craftsmen and can be realized with little difficulty. And yet others work as an artist might, (though some do start with sketches or even structured drawings) and let the project shape itself. And then there's others who may want to construct a period piece which require exacting details or even something of their own design that requires those details to be worked out on paper and then followed or failure may ensue.

I guess many have done all the above on one project or another. Shop drawings are necessary when transferring the build to other hands. There's no doubt about their need. The intent of the designer is difficult to understand without drawings. And, even with drawings, things can and do evolve when construction starts. A better way or some unrealized detail may become evident once the craftsman is in the process.
 
#23 ·
The problem I have with cultists . . . .

- runswithscissors
I have lots of problems with cultists, not usually involving woodworking though. :)

Not picking on you, scissors, but sometimes a small typo can totally change how you read a post and my warped sense of humor couldn't resist.
 
#24 · (Edited by Moderator)
The problem I have with cultists . . . .

- runswithscissors

I have lots of problems with cultists, not usually involving woodworking though. :)

Not picking on you, scissors, but sometimes a small typo can totally change how you read a post and my warped sense of humor couldn t resist.

- JayT
But then again … are not those whack-a-dos on Birds of a Feather cultists? LOL!
 
#25 ·
A lot of things can be built out of you head. Coffee tables, chests, dressers, etc. etc…

Someone made a comment that they would rather be in the shop working than in the office.

To me, time is short and I need to be as efficient as I can be while I'm in the shop.
Once you familiar with any drawing program it doesn't take much office time to layout a project.
And besides, it makes my head hurt trying to figure out every angle or joint.
Drawing it before hand and having a picture with measurements assures that my time in the shop will be positive and I won't be remaking pieces parts because I overlooked something.

I have never bought a set of plans to make anything, and I have made plenty of projects with a napkin sketch.
But now, I rarely go into the shop without a drawing of what I'm building.
 
#26 ·
I really enjoy the drawing process, so I end up drawing more than I need to. Have I ever built something from a plan and actually followed it? I think once, when I was 12 years old…

For me, the process of drawing helps me to think through the details. It forces me to plan the joints, get an idea of proportions, plan what thicknesses of lumber to purchase, etc. After I've built the project, I usually go through and red-line my "plans" so that I can build the project again if need be. And this step really isn't all that necessary, either, since the design came from my own head, and it's not like I'm going to have troubles doing it a second time!
And finally, I think I have yet to build two identical items, since every person has their own tastes and preferences.

Cut lists? Good way to waste lumber. They are good if you are making box cabinets and there's lots of standards and repeats. And they are good for ESTIMATING how much lumber to buy. But then, you need to verify each and every peice you cut, NOT follow the cut list, or else you'll be re-cutting your lumber and wasting…
 
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