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Watch my videos on my web site. This week: a defense of Ikea

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7K views 22 replies 21 participants last post by  JGM0658 
#1 ·
Watch my videos on my web site. This week: a defense of Ikea

For those of you who watch my videos here every Friday, thank you! Since LumberJocks doesn't seem to be interested in posting videos any longer, I want to invite all of you to visit my web site, where you can watch new videos every Friday and read more about my projects.

http://www.woodworkingformeremortals.com/

Make sure you never miss a video by subscribing to my channel, the most popular woodworking show on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/user/stevinmarin

This week's video: in defense of Ikea!

http://www.woodworkingformeremortals.com/2013/09/contemporary-book-stand-storage-unit.html

See you all over there!

Steve
 
#2 ·
You are right, Steve. They have things at Ikea that are targeted for a price range. But you can build thing just like them in the shop using their design and different materials to your liking.

...................Jim
 
#3 ·
As a snooty, lookin' down my nose kind of professional custom furniture/cabinetmaker for 30 years, I'd like to explain why we feel that way about Ikea. Yes, I did read and watch your article/video.

The stuff that Ikea sells is fine for many people. I have a couple of crappy things myself, though not from Ikea. Our problem with Ikea, which you don't seem to understand, is that introducing this type of knock-down furniture into the marketplace lowers peoples expectations about furniture/cabinetry in general. I can't tell you how many times I've been asked to build something cheaper than "Brand X" because that big factory has much more overhead than I do so I must be able to do it cheaper.

People that buy at Ikea now are of the opinion that a quality set of kitchen cabinets can be had for $3500. They don't understand that might be fine in a $35,000 house, but not so much in a $350,000 house and certainly not a $3.5 million house. But this is what they get used to and then expect. I can't earn a living building things cheaper than Ikea, nobody can. This is all part of the dumbing down of America.

There are lots of ways of building things and lots of different materials to build out of. The project you showed in this video is fine for a twentysomething, but a 35 yr old with a wife, two kids and these days two jobs cannot take the time to even do that simple a project. By the time they are 45 and moving into the "big house" they just built, if they think that melamine furniture is quality, they will be very dissapointed in a few years when it all falls apart.

It isn't about snootyness, it's about earning a living, producing quality work that can't be bought at a big box store. You don't need to defend Ikea and then rub our noses in it as if we don't understand. We do, you don't, based on your projects you are not earning a living creating wood projects. Do you think you struck a nerve, you did and I'm sure others will let you know also.
 
#4 ·
Wow Sam, I knew I would get a bite from a "fine" woodworker. It's another reason why the hobby is dying and comes across as elitist. There is no reason to feel threatened by inexpensive furniture. It's kind of like saying a Big Mac destroys fine dining.

It might be hard for you to imagine, but a lot of people aren't millionaires. It's sad to think that woodworking should only cater to the wealthiest. I am an advocate for people to interested in woodworking as a hobby. I want to expand the notion of woodworking to include everyone.
 
#5 ·
It would seem that Sam needs to find a new job!

I enjoy woodworking whether it is with costly zebra wood or poplar stained to look nice for a customer that can't afford $35,000 for cabinets. I love to watch your videos Steve, and if it was not for you I would have thought this hobby was out of my league because of money. But I do thank you Sam because of guys like you I have people waiting in line to have things built for a lower cost. But I don't do it for a living, I do it for the enjoyment of the craft.
 
#8 ·
Steve, I have been very interested in your projects. I don't always like what you do, but I do like the way you do it. Woodworkers can be artists and craftsman, but they should do there own thing. Woodworking is not an exact science. do what feels right to you. Keep up the good work and thanks for the projects each week. Canoe911 is completely right.

Larry
 
#9 ·
Never let perfect be the enemy of good. If I need fine furniture, I'll own fine furniture; I can afford it. If basic pieces will fill a need, then basic pieces will be acquired.

You can't sell a $1000 end table to someone with an Ikea living room, and you can't put a Billy bookcase in a university law library.

There's a place for everyone.
 
#12 ·
As an owner of no "fine" furniture (and anything I've made is the opposite of fine), some people just don't understand the need for a broad range of prices of items. I found the same kind of attitude when I was researching the replacement of a patio door. There were some who insisted that any door that was less than $4000 was garbage and they would not install it for a customer. I had a budget and tried to get the best value I could for the budget I had. The rest of my money goes to feed my food and shelter addiction.
 
#13 ·
Steve, love the videos. I have built a few of your projects. I watch because the videos are entertaining. I have picked up some new techniques and project ideas. Thank you for the time you invest in making the videos. I'm enjoying a cup of Joe (decaff) from a WWMM mug. I could have purchased a cheaper mug, it would provide the same functionality, but not the same sentiment. My small way of supporting the things I like and value. I like your notion of "woodworking for everyone" as it may get someone interested in woodworking as a hobby or career.

I don't think the hobby is dying. We all have a creative side and we will continue to express it. I enjoy viewing the projects here, although not all of them are "home runs." BTW, I've "struck out" a few times on projects myself. Not sure where the baseball analogies are coming from, but whatever.

Sam, I respect your view but disagree with your premise. All things are not equal. Some people like IKEA furniture and Walmart; different strokes for different folks. I see a Picasso and think "what was he smoking?" Yet, big money is spent for his works. I don't think you'd find a Picasso hanging above an IKEA bed. My point, people who are struggling will make due with what then can afford. If this stuff was not available, they would do without (been there, done that.) By the same token, if a client is indeed asking you to build something cheaper then a mass produced item, then they can do without the service you provide. Concentrate on clients that understand quality, and don't look back.

The "dumbing down of America" is a Madison avenue term that congers up an image of "everyone else" is getting dumber but me. If used in the collective "we" then whose getting dumber?

Markets are flooded with cheap goods. Its not going away any time soon. Yet, some folks seek out quality. That is your clientele.
 
#15 ·
WOW! Imagine going online and publicly showing your disdain and disrespect for every striving, hardworking AMATEUR woodworker AND about a billion global customers of a household name brand, at the same time as being dumb enough to do it under the literal banner of your or your boss's business!
 
#17 ·
Back in the good Old days I remember Steve built a Chess board that I would be consider fine woodworking for most woodworkers , it was so good It inspired me to build one of my own, I'm here to tell you if you think a brush on lacquer finish is easy just try it sometime. Go check out some of his first videos, there great.
I think Steve could be a "Fine" wood worker if he wanted to be, because he's that good, but chose to do what he's doing now, it fits the economy now, maybe things will change soon?
Had to add my 2 cents
 
#18 ·
Hi Steve I'm a big fan love your videos . I think that Earlextech was try to say not trying to defend or put words in his mouth. But what I interpreted it has him trying to saying the trade is dieing and he right . I read a couple comments and they all are saying there a hobbyist and some am I . But let face it sell your stuff at craft show are fine but your not going to pay your mortgage with that. When you have really craftsman trying to compete with big lot store they lose every time. Why they buy in large quantity from a factory so the price goes down and so does quality. A craftsman can't make it so only hand full make it selling to high end customer. I wish it was the other way around but it not. That why your seeing less custom woodworking shop and it just a matter that it will be a lost art . All that will be left are hobbyist. Just my thought.
 
#19 ·
Steve, Thanks for all the videos, ideas and encouragement.
Speaking only for myself as a new woodworker I really appreciate that you seem to be very encouraging of us newbies and often make suggestions of how to make your projects even easier. In my opinion, this is a great thing, especially for those of us who are barely even beginners.
Keep it up!
 
#20 ·
When I first started you were the one that I was not only learning from, but also very entertained by. You made me feel as though even I could build something and aloud me to build my knowledge base. I say keep doing your thing and remember you can't please everyone. But looking at your amount of followers you are doing something right! Can't wait for all your videos!

I even try to make things more inexpensive for clients now, not always possible. I'm a little minnow in a big pond so when I can take a bite away from the big fish I will!
 
#22 ·
I've already apologized directly to Steve for my post. As a custom cabinetmaker for 30 years this is an emotional topic for me. I would also like to apologize to the LJ community for my lack of restraint. I came across as everything Steve said I was. Arrogant, snooty, etc. I claim them all as mine and I'm not happy when they come out in my personality. I am not perfect.
I don't look down on amateur woodworkers, most people I know are amateurs and they do great work. But there is a huge difference in professional woodworking and weekend warrior. Ikea will never affect the amateur, actually it will probably help them. But it will affect the professional. That was my point but I said it in a borrish, horrible way.
I am sorry.
 
#23 ·
The problem I have with your "defense" is that, as they say in lawyer programs, you assume facts not in evidence. Lie Nielsen, Lee Valley, Bridge City Tools are doing better than ever, even in a poor economy. Woodworking and hand tools seem to be thriving.

Another thing is that "knock down" furniture does not necessarily mean "cheap". There is some very well made furniture (some even on this forum) that is capable of being disassembled.

I believe Earlextech's frustration is based more on the fact that if you factor in durability, a well made solid wood item in the long run is cheaper than Ikea. This has nothing to do with being snooty or elitist, and more to do with thoroughly thinking about a purchase . An Ikea item will show chipped corners, loose melamine, loose joints in about a year or so, a well made piece would not and would last for many years and changes of residence, the Ikea item you have to throw away and buy another one every time you move.

Woodworkers scoff at Ikea items simply because if you think about it, with a handful of screws, a router and a sheet of plywood you can make anything Ikea makes at a fraction of the price and will look much nicer.

You really should not chastise people for wanting to surround themselves with beautiful things instead of cheaply made furniture.
 
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